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windfalcon — Mary Sue - How to Tell
Published: 2004-02-25 08:27:37 +0000 UTC; Views: 430636; Favourites: 7006; Downloads: 44654
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EDIT 3: 11/22/09 You guys are kidding me XD For goodness sakes, reaaaaad the liink here: [link] Every time I get a comment that reads "the one on the left is a Mary Sue because she has green hair and a power," I realize that they're not reading the description which contains this link: [link]tl;dr: If 'special' traits fit in with the universe, it doesn't automatically make the character a Mary Sue. What if everyone else in Ami Machida's universe has green/blue/purple hair? What if everyone else has a cat power? Does that make her a Mary Sue? Not necessarily.
Please, spare me the time from having to point you BACK to the silly description and just take a minute to read the link. You know, the one I linked to a bunch of times up above. And the link here: [link]
EDIT 2: 10/11/09 I suppose this is long overdue, but for those of you with confusion, here is an explanation on why I perceive the one on the left as not a Mary Sue: [link] For the love of god stop whining about it D:
EDIT: 6/21/09 Okay, everyone, please chill with all the 'hay is my character a mary-sue!?11" questions. I get about 3 a day now and one thing you need to understand - I AM NOT AN AUTHORITY ON MARY SUES. This picture is a parody. Just for fun. The one on the right is obviously an extreme exaggeration of a stereotype and not the definitive definition for a Mary Sue. D:
Please full view. You won't be able to read the text if you don't.
For those of you who don't know, a Mary Sue, in a nutshell, is a fanmade character that is usually extremely beautiful, powerful, smart, talented, and in plain words, perfect in every way.
These characters tend to be quite a bother in fanfiction and role playing, since they simply can't be beat, and thus become boring.
Have any of you ever been rping, and come across a character who is like, " oh, well, that planet in the way isn't a problem *blows it up*"
Or, is like, "well, Vegeta and Goten and Trunks and Goku ALL have a crush on my character"
Yep. That's a Mary Sue.
So, for people who still don't understand, I made this little picture/diagram. Usually, Mary Sues have TONS of talents and TONS of powers, and no weaknesses.
Enjoy ^_^
-Done in Copic Markers, with the background and text done on computer -
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Comments: 4629
Old Man Yells At Cloud
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dear god, you actually choose to be this human being
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oh no i do care
i care because i am savoring these reactions
... and also because OP gave terrible advice that nobody should follow
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i just wanted to make sure i didn't misgender you
(i'm sure it's something you're unfamiliar with, you know, since you're a bigot and all)
i didn't read your second paragraph but i'm sure it's like the others please continue
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oh my god i've activated him
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While I can more or less get what are you trying to say, here's a fact for you: what other people do is not up to you.
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And you're giving this critique here, where it doesn't belong. Pat yourself in the back.
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oh god this is 14 years old deviantart what are you doing
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THIS IS SO OLD WHY IS THIS HOT RIGHT NOW
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mary-sue's don't exist anymore. mary-sue characters were bashed because other artists like to hurt younger artists and writers who are just having fun. they don't even have to be younger, they could be a decade older than everyone else and still, if their character is made out of love, it's not a mary-sue. their character could literally marry every main role, have over powered abilities, and never have any flaws, but if it's done out of pure creativity and good intentions, what is there to hate about it???
make your character. if their creation if flawed, you will iron out all the wrinkles in time. I have made so many 'cringey' characters that through the years of experimenting and building have turning into their own being. That if I told the story of those characters, someone could believe a real person lived through that.
Create what you want
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so true...
people hated on Mary sue OCs because they were just jealous on how creative that OC was and jealous of why they(the ocs) were so perfect <:3
maybe....? im not sure..
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this picture is from 2004
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and it's on the hot page. so i thought I'd drop a comment
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Mary Sues do still exist and will always exist aslong as little kids think their perfect OC is good.
by definition A Mary/Gary sue is a perfect character with either arbitrary or no flaws at all, and/or can be extremely OP. Unless that character is stated to be a gag character (Saitama) it is a Mary/Gary sue
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I have to agree with ByteMyFur that mary-sue's don't exist and were just a ploy against younger artists. There of course are characters who can be unlikeable or even unrelatable. But it's not like most of us are selling our work or even boasting how unique and wonderful a creator we are for making this ""mary-sue"". We're all here to share and see art others have done and maybe meet friends along the way.
Many artists on here made characters at a very young age. With that knowledge, it's mean-spirited when we put them down for having ridiculous characters because we perceive them as so. Constructive criticism does exist, you can give a nice comment first and then follow it up with a suggestion or concern. I'm not saying you're a horrible person at all, but you do remind me that we should treat young artists with respect.
I'm all for criticizing media that is supposed to be for viewer consumption but if someone wants to showcase their own work they're proud of on their own account, then who are we to roll our eyes and grotesquely comment how "mary-sue" of them.
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As the artist stated, we do that when those people invade RPs and ruin them.
Mary/Gary sues do exist. Do people use the term mostly incorrectly? Yes. Just like the word Nazi.
But do overly perfect/OP characters exist? Yes. It's just a matter if " Haha! What a gag character man Ecks dee" or "this is my awesome OC noone steal"
I've never put down a young artist. Have I given them criticism? Yeah of course. Along with other types of artist. But do I put them down? No.
Now. When it comes to RPs, thats when you gotta take action. I'm sure nobody would like it if you had a nicely planned out story, you're far ahead in it and then
King Dragon: "Well Archibald. You and your friends are helpless, waiting to die. Do you give up?"
Some Mary/Gary sue: no! *hits king dragon and kills him. She/he becomes hero to all*
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Side note, mary/gary sues are present in media and we kind of excuse them because they might be the only solution to the story at some point or maybe the only beacon of hope. Like they can be utilized and used effectively.
I thank you for not putting down artists, and I do mean that.
I haven't RP'd consistently in like yeeaarss. So, hypothetically, if I ever was in an RP where I had a nice set up going and a good plot going on and it was going all well until that One person decides to kill off an important part, I would probably pause and just go ".. uh, i'm sorry you can't kill them, it would not further the plot, plus we could make it more interesting."
It really doesn't take much to backtrack and communicate, and like you and I both said: constructive criticize can help both parties. And hypothetically, if the RP is going south with the person refusing to play along with the kind of story you had set up, then I would tell I'm done with this RP is within reach because it's no longer fun.
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Honestly whenever I have a Mary/Gary sue in an RP (well. Had. I no longer RP as of now), I block them if its early on.
Yes. There are some Mary/Gary sues in media.
All might could be considered a Gary Sue. But he isn't. Because he's a goal. Usually when a character like that is used for a solution or beacon of hope, it's usually called a Deus Ex Machina. I think. But like in All Might's case, He is a Power Cieling. A goal for Midoriya to strive for. But as AM is a hero, You would need to see him being well. Heroic. And to see why he is the Power cieling. Thus, All Might vs Noumo.
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you put that so perfectly! Thank you!!!
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thank you for starting the dialogue !!
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and as long as assholes pick on young artists expressing themselves with characters that make THEM happy, I will forever defend them and their right to have whatever character they want.
mary-sues do not exist. assholes exist. stop bringing people down for having over the top characters
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They are not assholes (well. Some may be.), they criticize.
If i wasnt told "hey. You should improve your anatomy. You characters look like fucking jelly" i would still be drawing wierd jelly chibis today.
Im not an asshole yet i still dislike mary/gary sues.
Yes. They do exist. Yes
They also exist. But giving criticism isnt being an asshole. Neither is saying "Your character is too perfect an OP. You should make your characters more realistic."
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Telling someone their character isn't good enough because it isn't 'realistic' to the story is garbage. It's not criticism at that point, it's nitpicking something you have no creative liberty over and telling the artist/writer to change just because you don't like it.
Criticism is 'i don't think her pet is an interesting addition'
People calling others' characters Mary-Sues is 'the fun you're having making characters??? yeah stop. make it more realistic'
You wanna tell every creative young artist their sparkledog fursona is garbage because 'dogs don't look like that'??? Fine. You are the asshole. You are creating a box, and keeping yourself in it when you do that. Instead of telling someone to change their incredibly outlandish character, how about you ask about it instead? Help them build upon it until all those holes are filled and they have reached a new kind of story that no one has touched on before?
Mary-Sues don't exist. Assholes like you do though. I'm done
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I used to turn myself into an overpowered marysue character when I was 11, with Naruto roleplayers on YouTube. And I have to say.. I'm glad people criticized me, or else I wouldn't have been able to develop characters properly.
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im sure you still had fun with your overpowered marysue because you were 11. Like what I'm getting at is that creating anything from thin air can generally lead to nice, fun feelings. I remember RPing as a child so vividly and without a care in the world but now it's kind of hard to do that with time management and I think making sure writing/characters sound appealing.
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Yes I did have fun, especially on kid sites like ClubPenguin. I agree it can lead to fun feelings. And I think people should be allowed to create marysues without being harshly criticized or bullied.
But I still believe marysues exist, due to the large abundance of them. And because a majority who create them are younger artists who are inexperienced with character creation. Marysues should still be allowed though, and at times can work perfectly in a setting made for a god character, but otherwise I think these artists should be encouraged nicely in the right direction. If they want to succeed with character creation, that is.
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I'm pretty sure you just matured like every other artist and writer out there. With more interaction comes more examples of things you enjoy, and so you learn how to draw/write those things you enjoy. I'm not saying 'don't criticize'. I'm saying 'Mary-Sues don't exist, and to say there is a right and wrong way to create characters is inherently restricting our future artists'
I gain more knowledge about my 'mary-sue' characters through people interested in them as they are than I do from people finding flaws in them. When you're asked things about a characters details, they immediately gain more depth and lose that 'mary-sue'-ness of them.
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I see what you're getting at. I agree there isn't a right or wrong way to go about character creation. People should be free to make what they want. It's their artistic expression. People should be free to create what they what, and also to create any mistakes so that they'll learn for the future.
I disagree that marysues don't exist, due to the large abundance of them. And because a majority who create them are younger artists who are inexperienced with character creation. These artists shouldn't be restricted, but nicely pointed in a better direction. That is if they're serious about character creation, and want their characters to come off as more professionally developed.
I think the marysue in the example above is too cluttered, with extra traits that make it look like its uniqueness is being forced. I can't get a grasp for her personality, because it's like an essay with paragraphs that have topics completely separate from the main topic. Simplicity and organization is key if you want to get a message across through art.-- This is advice I learned from an advertising art class, but it can apply here. And it's meant for artists who plan on taking their character design more seriously for an audience of people.
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Did i ever state that i have ever criticized someone? No. I said I dislike Mary/Gary sues.
I only start "criticizing", if you can call it that, when its in RPs, which i do not do anymore. Stop being so butthurt
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What if the backstory was someone trying to make the perfect person?
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So. . .what's your take on whatshername from the latest Star Wars movies?
Anyway, a well balanced character should have One Weakness for One Strength. Not striking a balance either creates someone that ends up being 'Too Dumb To Live' or a 'Mary Sue'.
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When the powerful roleplayer comes and uses the cat butt stars to rp *hits and kills*
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I think this is an important thing for writers to keep in mind, it's good to get invested in your characters but if you start writing your characters as characters you've already failed.
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Good role players vs. bad role players....
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Thanks for doing this, this is the guide I used in order to make my own OC better, so thanks for that!
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please do not use this as your guide, the character on the left has absolutely no personality. obviously avoid the character on the right, but avoid the character on the left too.
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Yeah I am a writer and know how to make a character realistic and convincing. This was a good beginner guide for me though
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Well, Mary Sue or not, here's one thing: let people dream. Let them imagine whatever they want. Reality can be harsh for them, and maybe they're trying to get some comf making this type of character, especially when it's a self insert.
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