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#amendment #ii #rights
Published: 2019-09-09 19:45:19 +0000 UTC; Views: 1641; Favourites: 33; Downloads: 2
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Amendment IIA well regulated militia, being necessary to the security of a free state, the right of the people to keep and bear arms, shall not be infringed.
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In 1775, King George sent out an edict, disarming the American colonists. Tell me, how did that work out for the British Army charged with enforcing it?
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I wonder if gun-grabbers realize that they're basically begging for a spike in gun violence by threatening to rob legal gun owners of their constitutional rights.
Not smart to play with fire like that!
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So legal gun owners will use their firearms against innocent people if they don't get their way?
If that's the case then the biggest threat to the security of a free state is from this "well regulated militia" rather than some tyrannical government. Well done bozo.
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Except my gun does literally nothing to impede upon your safety.
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True, but it's owner just promised to use it on "gun-grabbers" if his constitutional rights are infringed.
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Why is that such a hard thing to avoid? I thought liberals were all about punching fascists?
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That hasn't been true since 1812 mate, at the latest it died on the fields of Passendale. It only got worse since then (the Warsaw Uprising is what happens when you've got a military going up against militia, and those who read their history know that it didn't end well for the militia). Anyone peddling this sort of thing is deluded to the extreme, as the main offensive implement isn't the firearm but things like howitzers, mortars, tanks, aircraft, and other heavy implements of war.
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Im going to chime in here as Im a Constitutionalist in the US.
First, Im not trying to start and argument for anyone else that may try to chime in on this for that purpose. If you are here for that purpose, dont expect a response.
Secondly, the thing about the US military that many from other countries don’t understand (Not a quip) is that The US military swears an oath to defend the constitution. In fact the oath reads as follows:
“I, (NAME), do solemnly swear (or affirm) that I will support and defend the Constitution of the United States against all enemies, foreign and domestic; that I will bear true faith and allegiance to the same; and that I will obey the orders of the President of the United States and the orders of the officers appointed over me, according to regulations and the Uniform Code of Military Justice. So help me God.”
There's a reason the Constitution is listed First in the oath. Its in the event that those in charge decide they want to throw it out altogether. Another thing that most don’t understand, (And for the life Of me I cant figure out liberals in the US not understanding this.) %99.999 of those who enlist in the US military don’t do it because they hate guns. You can order the military to do what ever you want all you can. But when you tell the military they have to go and kick in the doors of their parents, uncles, grandparents house and take their guns by force, they will find the same thing out that many of the states in the US discovered when they told law enforcement to enforce what is Unconstitutional doctrine. They refused. In fact a sheriff in Washington flat out refused to enforce it. When they threatened to fire him if he didn’t, he handed them his badge and told them good luck getting his deputies to follow the order as well. That ended that.
You have to remember, the last time the Government in America tried to take guns from its citizens for their own protection:
“There Was A British Flag Hanging Over The Capital.”
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That... isn't exactly the case mate, the moment things like the Insurrection Act and the President's 'Roman Dictator (the office) style Emergency Powers' get used, the bill of rights more or less goes out the window.
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You really don’t understand how things work in the real world. (not trying to be a dick, I know how it sounds)
Your right, the president can enact executive order suspending the Constitution and the Bill of Rights all he wants which is what executive order does. It removes congress from the equation and puts military troops in every town.
What you don’t seem to under stand. (and again, not trying to be an ass) is that’s like the order to launch nuclear weapons. Hear me out.
The president is the only one who can authorize the launch and use of nuclear weapons. However, contrary to what people have seen on tv and movies, there is no actual BIG red button the president pushes to launch the weapons. He gives the order, and it comes down to the guys in the silos and on the submarines to actually push the buttons. The reason the system is set up that way is so in the event that the president loses his mind (I know I know Don’t get me started) and decides to launch the weapons because the toaster made the suggestion, it cant happen.
Same thing applies to martial law. You can give the order all you want. But it comes down to the guys in the field. ALL Soldiers Sailors Airman and Marines take an oath to protect and defend the Constitution as I previously stated. And are obligated under that oath and affirmation thereof, to disobey ANY order to violate that. As I said before, that’s why the Constitution is listed first in the oath.
The president can order it all he wants, but if the commanders and soldiers in the field refuse to follow an order violating the Constitution then Congress can seize power under executive decision with the backing of the military and put an end to something like that. You should read our Constitution. There are quite a few provisions for something like that. While tin office, the president can send the military anywhere he want. Declare war on whomever he wants. Its congress though that gives the money to keep them there. And Congress is supposed to act in the interest of the people of the US.
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Nope, you don't understand mate. There are rules and statues within the US volume of law that basically throw the Bill of Rights out the window when enacted. This is outlined in our very constitution no less. We're talking 'Roman Dictator' grade powers here...
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No offense, but you really dont know the American people do you?
You states rules and government like people here just follow it blindly. They tried making laws that were enforceable under dictatorial law in several states here in the US. Each and every time they found out that the People didn’t follow the laws and law enforcement was reluctant to use force to do the will of the law makers. In each and every case, the story disappeared from the news as a result and hasn’t been heard about sense.
You’ll find that the American people don’t roll over and beg because someone said heal. The last time that happened in the United States was April 12th 1861. That nearly destroyed the US.
The military wont just blindly follow an unconstitutional order either. You should really look at our history. Field commanders have to option of disobeying an illegal order. Military officers and commanders are required to follow what is known as the UCMJ (Uniform Code Of Military Justice) Article 92 outlines what following orders means. It states as follows:
“(1) violates any lawful general order or regulation;
(2) having knowledge of any other lawful order issued by a member of the armed forces and fails to obey the order; or
(3) is derelict in the performance of his duties; shall be punished as a court-martial may direct.”
Lawful order. That’s the key. If the government gives an unlawful order, say to remove the Bill of Rights Because you don’t like people having an opinion and voicing it. The US Military Is allowed to disobey any order that violates the UCMJ which is governed by the US Constitution and the Bill Of Rights.
Now you can try and argue that point all you want, both or sides of the issue are merely speculation as nothing like this has happened sense the Civil War here. But I personally believe that, as having been in the US Military, that given an order to defy the Constitution and throw out the Bill Of Rights, those 2,141,900 members of the armed services will NOT follow an unlawful order. You have to look at the people, not the order.
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That doesn't matter if the emergency powers get enacted. Those are lawfully given (even by the constitution!) in the case of certain scenarios, and they will follow with mumbling and grumbling. Forget that and you'll get screwed.
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Well, we’ll just have to agree to disagree then.
I know the people in the military having been one, and you know only what you’ve seen and heard on TV and the news.
Theres a big difference between reality and what people think is going to happen. Liberals in this country thought that they were going to order the law enforcement in their states to forcibly seize guns and kick in doors. The reality of the situation, it never happened, even at executive order from the state level. And we’re talking about people who had served in the military. They outright disobeyed an order that was unconstitutional and in at least one case, outright said so.
You’re going off of some sort of idea that people are mindless machines that follow orders. I’ve already seen what happens when you give an unlawful order so far. People Don’t follow it.
And based on that, I think it will go my way and not the automaton way you think will happen.
Oh and by the way, if you give an order that violates the Constitution, by definition it is an UNLAWFUL order UNDER the Constitution by definition and would therefore be considered illegal and members of the military would be under NO obligation to follow.
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Nope, there are all sorts of laws and statutes -including a few emergency powers within the constitution itself- that waves that. Ignoring them will not change reality.
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The problem is your missing the point.
All those statutes and laws, all the legislature in the world still come down to the person on the ground. They can make all the laws they want, but that still hinges on the guy on the ground following the order.
And the soldier on the ground wont follow an illegal order telling them to kick in the door of their house to grab the guns from their own family members. That would be the beginning of the next American civil war.
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Yet terroists and Gorilla fighters still managed to put up a very long war of attrition against such firepower. From two superpowers no less.
Also Contrary to a common belief by fanatics the US miltary would be mostly with the people and not some oppressive socialist regime trying to disarm its citizens and create a new communist state.
The Hague convention made it very clear that following an order does not make you innocent and as such soldiers at least in the US Military are trained that if an unlawful order is given then it is his duty to not follow it.
I've heard this used many times and boy was the officer or higher enlisted pissed, thankfully despite being angry they can't legally do spit.
Case and point when a Sargent says give me 2-300 pushups you can flat out tell him and say that is an unlawful order and not do anything.
Then there is also the fact that 1/3 of the US is armed that is more then most nations populations and the Liberal scumbags will never achieve the Military support or law enforcement to carry out unlawful acts. Which would result in a Civil war that the Liberals would loose and loose hard. Even now more and more people are breaking away from the Democrats because there is only so much crazy one can support.
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That... isn't exactly right, and you know it. The only reason that Vietnam was lost was a combination of Russia giving armaments to North Vietnam and the utter debacle that was the PR war. Afghanistan is because of the bad PR and the fact that Pakistan's ISI was backing the Taliban.
Every single time that the terrorists and gorilla fighters won is with the immense resources of a nation-state backing them up and bad PR.
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The US won the Vietnam War and it won more or less the current campaigns. Look up Paris peace accords if you think I'm wrong. Though your right about the backing. However in the US case should a second civil war happen gun owners have ammo and the manufactures would be secured very quickly.
Again though the Liberals would be the Rebels in this case just as they were back in 1860s when Blue states removed themselves from the Union. Right now the number of Gun owners is roughly 1/3 of the US population and that number is climbing. I have faith that if soldiers are told to point their weapons at the people just to enforce a communist socialist dictatorship. Then they will turn their weapons on the politicians much like the Egyptian military did after a long time.
Soldiers aren't brainless killers they are people just like you and me. Thank you Also the media can kiss my white behind and in my book reporters are the enemy most of them anyway.
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Nope, the GOP burned far too many bridges with the military, so they'll side with the Dems.
That is fantasy pure and simple.
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what about if government goes bad
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Then you have no way to win because you can't fucking win. You are far better to keep your head down and wait until it blows over.
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Okay Now I have to ask what nation are you from?
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Great Falls, Montana.
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Really I'll be darn you don't live far from me then. Also yea no do you don't and I'll tell you why the 116th is loyal to the Constitution not to the president to the Constitution. Since the 116th lies in the northweast and is headquartered in Boise I can say for certian from every vet I've ask they would not turn their guns on the people if the president said so. Ask the Airforce Airmen in your area they will tell you the same thing.
Crews can't live in there vehicles all the time and US bases aren't as fortified as you think.
Let me ask you this do you really think soldiers who swear and Oath to Defend the Constitution of the United States are going to break that oath. If some lowlife in congress tells them to.
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That flies into the face of certain powers and laws, including the 'Roman Dictator Powers all but in Name (use in case of major holy shit class emergency, full confirmation only available via Act of Congress)' that the US president has and the Insurrection Act.
If either gets enacted, then basically it's game over.
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Hope for the best, only a military can fight a military on anything resembling equal terms... and for a guerilla force to do that it'll need a nation-state backer to get the equipment necessary to fight a military force on anything more than a nucence level.
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The people in the Warsaw Ghetto didn't have the luxury of waiting...they were going to perish whether they fought or not. As it was, the ones who couldn't escape went to the death camps.
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Even then, they had no chance at all against the local Nazi forces. They weren't backed by a nation-state, they didn't have enough then-modern equipment to fight the Nazis...
... all they did was make a few temporary gains and die, only making the situation harsher for the rest as a consequence. That is how big the gulf between militia/terrorist/guerilla is. You only die in the process if the shooting starts. That is the reality of reality. You either have to be a nation-state or one of the mentioned groups backed by a nation-state to win. The balance of power is just that lopsided... and has been for centuries.
The more you ignore this, the more you kill people for ideas.
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Then you die... simple as that.
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I give up, this guy would rather live as a slave, content to just live in squaler while the dictator forces the innocent to warship him like a deity. He will also be stuck in the house, not allowed to leave unless a woman tells him to. Hooked to leash like a dog and never allowed to experience happiness even in death. Death will likely come from plague as well so dying a slow death knowing that the new heath care system is to slow to even help you in time.
Your daughters raped on the streets, your sons in gangs and likely raping again. Abortion made legal when the baby is 1 year old. But yes let fear grip you pray that should those days come that you will be nice and happy while those who try and restore the Constitution of the United States fight and die for a cause worth fighting for while you stay couped up like a coward loyal only to your next meal because you fear death more then you fear having fewer rights then an animal.
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Here is the thing mate, the ability of the State to simply win when there is no outside influence is immense. So immense that you can't even picture the gulf between a rag-tag group of resistance fighters and a genuine military.
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if its a order ageist the us constitution an bill of rights most armed forces will not take that order
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You may want to reread your sentence as it doesn't make much sense also I agree with you sir to the bitter end. I just pray a civil war doesn't happen the the Liberals loose control. After all War is an absolute Last resort. period. Thank you.
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guy thinks armed forces will side with Democratic Socialists
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Can you delete my message, where I insulted the guy. I can't believe I let myself get triggered by someone like that. Unless you like it enough not to. In which case I won't hold it against you. I don't like hate, its evil and should never be used. Even in war or in politics, it clouds the mind makes you stupid, causes mistakes.
Its why I like the saying in star wars. Fear leads to anger, anger leads to hate, hate, leads to suffering. Thank you and I hope you have a nice week ahead of you.
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That... doesn't work if things like the Insurrection Act and/or the 'Roman Dictator Powers all but in Name' emergency powers for the President is enacted... both of which have requirements that are very... malleable...
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an unlawful order will not be fallowed. code of military justice
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Thanks to precedent, that only happens with the winning team against the losing team. Period.
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