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zilla774 — BETA Watch 2.0 Notes
Published: 2015-11-17 12:43:34 +0000 UTC; Views: 10957; Favourites: 3; Downloads: 0
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We just released a BETA preview of the new Watch. Go check out the launch article. There's a host of info there, you can try it out and watch videos of all the new features.
Beta Preview of Watch 2.0 This preview is available to a small group of new deviants, as well as Core Members who were Beta Testers as of November 11th. We will continue to add deviants to the preview group in the coming days and weeks. The heart of the DeviantArt experience is based on viewing and interacting with the art and activity from the deviants and groups you watch. Today, we’re providing an early preview into Watch 2.0 — where we’ve taken the activities deviants do most and built an experience geared toward exactly those actions.
Please keep in mind that this is an early Beta Preview. You are likely to encounter bugs and functions that are stil...
I don't normally comment on any feature release directly in my journals. I prefer to keep them to personal updates, not work related ones. But I'm going to break that habit and give some comments and feedback on this launch. Why? Because whilst I like to jump straight into launch articles and comment directly on people's feedback, it is also super time consuming. As part of this process I see a lot of very similar comments. Some really awesome (both positive and constructive feedback), some frustrating. So I wanna lay out some quick responses to that journal which I'm hoping will shed some light on the things we're attempting to do.
WHAT IS BETA TESTING?Seems a bit silly to be putting that here right? Perhaps if you're already a BETA tester, but for those who have yet to try out this aspect of their CORE membership I hope this will flesh it out a little:
In a nutshell BETA testing gives you access to new features we're actively developing across the site. They'll be specific features undoubtedly shown in seeming isolation from the site. They might be a different color, or flow to what you're used to. They might be buggy, act strangely, or be just straight out broken at times.
BETA testing happens near the end of our design cycle. By the time you're seeing something in BETA it's already been worked on for several months and gone through many design iterations, evaluating UX flows, building out prototypes, creating comps and specs along the way before it's even hit the developers here at DeviantArt. When the developers have released the first iteration of the final code that's when you guys get your hands on the BETA release. This is the point where we want to test what we believe is a workable product. We need you to test it, stretch it and break it, only then can we make educated decisions and fix issues before a final release. There may be one or more rounds of testing. Things might change a lot, or very little.
Early access brings its own rewards, you get to try stuff before anyone else. Most importantly it allows you to MAKE A DIFFERENCE to what we're doing here. Your feedback at this stage of development is vital to us shipping a final product.
BETA TESTING IS PROBABLY GOING TO BE CONFUSINGWhen you sign up for the BETA testing program you are almost guaranteed to be confused by something. That's not saying you guys are stupid, far from it. More that this is BETA testing. Things are being evaluated. Some things WILL be broken. Some things WILL be missing. Some parts won't necessarily make sense. But this is part and parcel of entering into these tests. If you don't like these aspects then you're probably not going to want to turn on that feature.
The key to avoiding that feeling of confusing is to be objective, accept that it'll be strange at first, but after a few hours or days of really using the feature you'll understand better what is good and bad or just plain broken about the feature. Remember that you're actively helping us evaluate a new product and this is part of the process.
"YOU'RE KILLING MY MESSAGE CENTER"No, this is NOT a replacement to the message center. This is an upgrade of the Watch page. Your notifications and notes remain unaffected as does the watch element of the message center.
"NO REALLY, IT'S MAKING ME MAD"We're not intentionally trying to confuse/annoy/frustrate. What we're trying to do is give you early snapshots of developmental work that we're keen to improve. Lots of stuff will run slow, or not at all. That's the nature of it. But I guarantee that if you return in 24hrs those things will have improved. We received a lot of requests to be more open about new features and an equal amount of people asking to help us out. Hence why the BETA program exists. Remember that you guys are the lifeblood of the site in that respect. You're at the pointy end of the development process and are an important part of shaping how a feature ends up.
"YOU DON'T LISTEN"I hear this a lot. It makes me sad. Honestly. Let me state here, categorically, that we DO listen. We DO read all the comments and we do react to the things that are presented to us.
"OUR FEEDBACK ISN'T VALUED/WE'RE NOT VALUED"YES, yes it is. Yes you are. Why would we release to BETA if we didn't actively want feedback and constructive evaluation?
"THE SITE LOOKS A MESS/THE STYLE IS DIFFERENT"Because we're releasing features for testing in isolation the site is going to look pretty messed up outside of that feature. For example the header in the BETA is confusing. Why? Because it's really only designed to work in the new framework and outside of watch you're in the old framework. This is why there's an opt in/out button bottom left of your browser.
We know that the header is basically broken in browse. There's currently no sub navigation available if you have the feature turned on. That means two things: firstly you need to turn the test off if you want to find What's Hot, or Undiscovered, and secondly that no we're not killing What's Hot or Undiscovered.
The dark style that watch has is the new branding that we're adopting. Those of you who use the mobile app, or read the hq journals (or follow any of the active staff members) will be aware of that style by now. This is just the natural evolution of the site.
"SOMETHING IS MISSING/BROKEN OUTSIDE OF THE WATCH"Yup, more than likely. This is due to the Watch BETA and can be rectified by turning off the test when you're outside of the Watch. Any features that were missing will reappear and will be present when the watch goes live in the future.
"I CAN'T DELETE FROM THE WATCH"
Nope, you can't. That's because it's a feed of items more akin to browse than your message center. Like I said, this isn't a replacement to the message center, it's designed to be complimentary.
"DAILY DEVIATIONS ARE MISSING"They are not present in Watch as it stands today, but if you look cloely you'll see a COMMUNITY tab and this is where DDs will live when we finally go live. They'll get their own promotion and we still feel just as strongly about them as we always did. They'll also still be part of Browse (Explore).
"WILL THE REST OF THE SITE LOOK LIKE THIS?"Yes, at some point in the future everything will be rolled out to this style. If you want to know more about what features are coming be sure to keep an eye on the Timeline .
EVALUATIONS ARE MORE VALUABLE TO USShort "nope" comments, whilst valid communication of your frustrations, are not all that helpful to me when trying to discern what it is that people don't like about a feature. Please please please try to be constructive and evaluate the feature before giving feedback. I totally appreciate that things will be confusing when you're first exposed to them but we can't help fix what's wrong without understanding what the issues are. Only fair right?
OK, HOW DO I HELP YOU GUYS?There's no strict way of giving feedback. However you feel you want to communicate things to us is good. Giving a constructive list of Pros, Cons and Bugs is a really smart way to do it though. That's what I personally find the most useful.
If you're reporting a bug (or something that doesn't seem to make sense) then it's also useful to us that you include your browser version and what platform you're reporting from. Not essential but helps us track down system specific bugs.
You can comment on the launch article, or you can send me a comment here. If you prefer to chat via skype, or notes, then I will absolutely take time to do that. Whatever you feel most comfortable with.
DO YOU JUST WANT THE BAD STUFF?Sure, but it's always nice to hear what we're doing well! Otherwise we might accidently remove things you liked unknowingly. Constructive criticism should be just that though, constructive. Be objective and remember that your comments will be read by a thinking, feeling human being (ie Me).
IS THERE ANYTHING ELSE I NEED TO KNOW?Yup, try navigating Peek views with your keyboard. You can go previous and next with your arrow keys, zoom in and out with the Z key and Fave and Save with F and S respectively.
OK, I UNDERSTAND, LET ME TRY THE FEATURE!Turn on the Watch 2.0 (remember you can turn this off at any time). Please try to use it for a few hours at the very least. Then please reach out to me directly if you would prefer and I'll happily chat to you.
Thanks guys, your time, feedback and help is really appreciated.
Ian.
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Comments: 41
So will we have an official word on if this is implemented for good?
I rather liked it and Beta Testing 2.0 was fun. I hope it comes back soon.
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Having now used this for a week or more (can't remember when I last commented!) I've a few things I wanted to mention..
I dearly miss my stick menu* (Is that what its called?) Having my most used links available has always been a blessing - and right now its a bit like somebody has cut a few of my fingers off my right hand - especially now the channels page has been removed - which I also used frequently. Everything that was on my personal menu is still obviously there, but its all over the place, 2 or 3 in one menu over there, another one over the other side, some in a completely different area accessed in a roundabout way. It makes my use of the site slower - and thats no good to me as my time is so limited these days. I'm sure I would eventually memory map the new locations out of continual use - but its not intuitive, and its not enjoyable I shouldn't need to go looking for stuff. I don't actually see why the new main menu couldn't be augmented with the existing user defined links list below it as exists already. (Perhaps I am preempting this, and the secondary menu will still be a feature?)
Bug - the new dark green strip across the top is not working well with the moveable left hand column in my MC - trying to drag and drop items into my list of user created folders leave the top 3 or 4 hidden by the menu - so theres some work to be done on alignment etc - plus theres a very odd white box just visible underneath the strip on the left hand side.
General usage of the journals and polls watch page - I can't get to grips with it. Its either my OCD or just a genuine dislike for the page layout for this type of deviation.
I actually think the problem I am having is that looking at the page on my 24 inch monitor is completely and utterly overwhelming by just how much stuff there is on the page - even in grid format. Makes me feel dizzy as theres no "resting spots" for my eyes, and each square and set of text on the journals and polls is still messy - as everyone uses different font sizes and backgrounds so theres little or no continuity! I've had to take my browser out of full screen mode and half the width to be able to just about manage more than 3 or 4 minutes looking at the journals/polls page.
I'm not sure how you'd go about solving that other than making all of the previews use a standardized font size for pure readability.
I'd rather just stick with my message center and avoid this section of the watch2.0 altogether which is what I've found myself doing the past couple of days - as long as it remains an optional use page and doesn't ultimately take over the message centre I can deal with that, but to be completely truthful if I was asked to use just the new watch page I'd probably stop using the site - and thats the first time I've ever had that sort of gut reaction to any change made to the site! D;
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thanks for the feedback
we know about those bugs (all the ones you listed)
Not sure about the sticky counts. That's up in the air right now.
In terms of the Posts page, yes I agree, its not working as well as I'd hoped. I've been trying out some small tweaks to the page to try and fix the feel of it and it might just be as simple as bigger thumbs, less of a grid, or a straight out list view. Or it might be better to fold everything into an All tab - which actually eases the issues a lot. I'm sure we'll work it out soon though
Again, thank you for the constructive thoughts.
i.
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No worries 
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Thank you for taking time to write all this out. Very informative and very glad to hear that Watch 2.0 isn't a replacement for the message center. After working through 2.0 for a couple days, here's my conclusions so far:
Pros:
*I actually do like the new toolbar, especially the drop menu for "submit."
*I do like how the toolbar fades as you scroll down, but it's accessible if we hover over it so you don't have to scroll to the top of the page.
*The notes icon is great (props to whoever suggested that one).
*The color scheme is nice, very clean and crisp and looks professional (again, props to you guys).
*The actual concept of Watch 2.0 is pretty interesting. I'm glad that were are able to do things such as decide whether or not to include collections or not and to customize out deviant's list (the pin feature is neat!). The features, although it took a bit to get the hang of it, were overall, pretty nice.
Cons:
*The layout is rather odd to me. I find it extremely difficult to sort through what stuff I've looked through and what I haven't (no notification of any kind/any way to delete deviations, (possible downside to it being like the browse page)). The submit new art/literature boxes feel like they've been randomly dropped in, especially since it doesn't scroll down like the deviant's list (it also seems redundant since we can just use the submit button in the toolbar). The uniformity feels lost in some parts because some of the links change color when you hover over them and others don't. The comments when you look at deviations through 2.0 are difficult for me to read without them being contained in their own individual box with backdrop (if that makes sense).
*The ability the drag and drop into my favorites and collections is something I utilize all the time. Not having it for Watch 2.0 is a HUGE deterrent to me using it frequently.
*Not being able to see who's online at the moment (Personally, I think having it back in the toolbar would be nice).
*Not really a con but: "Menu" kind of looks out of place. It's the only one without some kind of icon or drop menu and I had no idea what it was for. I was a bit surprised when I clicked on it.
*Again not really a con: I wouldn't mind it if the black toolbar was green like it is away from Watch 2.0 (or some matching shade). Probably be easier for people to accept the change when it goes live and when the rest of the site changes to match the color scheme and layout (I assume that would eventually happen). Plus it might go with the links better since they color green when you hover over them.
Bugs (for Firefox 42.0):
*The drop menu for deviants is cut off for the ones at the bottom of the list.
*At one point, I wasn't able to close a collection after viewing some of the art in it.
The biggest downside for me (and others in the same boat) is that I have an older computer with older browsing systems. Watch 2.0 doesn't work on my version of Safari (because it's so ancient) but it does work in Firefox at the moment. I do wonder how long that will last though.
Overall though, I think 2.0's got good potential and it's off to a pretty good start. I look forward to seeing how it progresses!
Thank you and with regards,
Hawkeye
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I am really diggin it and I have only one or two bugs I see but everything else is so easy to use. I don't know if I leave the bugs in this journal along with the things I like or write it in the other journal after the 3 days challenge. (Which Is tomorrow for me I think)
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you can leave it whereever you want, either, both, I don't mind! We'll get the feedback regardless!
(but posting it here guarantees I'll react to it sooner)
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I left a comment on Danlev's journal too and I know you guys are aware of all the stuff that is going on and the bugs.
So as far as I know my first reply below still stands as an issue but the biggest is people bot being able to submit Deviations and Stash.
Either way, you know about all this so I will end here and thanks for getting back to me. <3
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Cool. Thanks Sir.
So far I have noticed scrollable boxes go up and over the bar and cover the options to the left side of screen. Or Right if your custom scroll boxes are on the right.
Also I think I already got my answer from reading other responses but people are saying they cannot drag and drop favourites.
Other than that Sir, I have had no problems, everything seems to coincide in harmony and I rather like it.
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Well this is unrelated but I would like to see a Beta Tester center button. I see updates in "Hot Topic" but I normally delete that message after reading and go back and test things later. So it would be nice if there was a button for us testers to go strait to the newest updates. With this newest update it took me a while to find my way back to the journal.
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Thank you for these notes!
I'll try to make my feedback more constructive and not to complain about the new color scheme (only about white text on black - it really does hurt)
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I think most people panicked (myself included) because they thought this was a replacement for the notification center 
I haven't had much time to test it properly, but what I did really like about it was the design. I don't see myself using this particular feature much since I used my notification center for everything, not too keen on activity feeds and such, but I am really looking forward for the entire site to be changed to the new style, it's been a long time since we've had a major overhaul on the site design and (call me crazy) but I always get excited for those. I get bored easily!
The new thumbnail grid = love
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I was so relieved to read a particular answer, that involving the message center. It was not clear before if this will be a replacement or complimentary to what it is now. Thank you for putting that to rest.
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Can you at least make it so that people have to option to switch back and forth between layouts just like we have now with the test? Because personally, I much prefer the older version and I'm sure many, many people would agree. It would really make many people happy for that option. Thanks.
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do you really prefer watch 1.0 vs the new one? (or are you comparing this with the message center, which we will not be replacing)
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Yeah, to be honest I do :/ I just like the simplicity of it, the old design, etc...
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I like the look dA now. It's original and to the point. If you really do value our opinions, show it. Don't make us feel down because your ideas aren't what you want to hear. You have to take the criticism even if people are so harsh about it. I had to learn that the hard way and I am now more accepting of it.
Everything I know is still in the making. I know you cannot please everybody and there's no stopping to it, but if majority doesn't want it, then don't make them use it. Option buttons never work though but maybe for this one, give it to us. I like the new color. Black looks nice but I like green, too.
And again the new navigation bar you're trying to propose looks like crap. Don't like the look of the icons...it boring....okay.
I hope you understand. The watch system is to my liking but the nav isn't.
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I agree, I personally think that they should keep it like this and stop trying to update. This is the look deviantART should always have because this is what deviantART is about...
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[" That's because it's a feed of items more akin to browse than your message center. Like I said, this isn't a replacement to the message center, it's designed to be complimentary. " ]
Of many important things stated in this very useful breakdown, this one made me go "phew"
My initial reaction is that it feels awkward, but I think thats purely because I've only been playing about with it for an hour or so. (I'll let you know in a few days if that changes lol) Given the fact that you already clarified above that the message centre will remain intact makes me rethink my first impression, as the thought of trying to navigate comments and notes etc from the small drop down list on the top right made my eyeball spasm. (multiple clicks on clicks to find what the deviant actually said in their comment is not fun!)
I'm sure I've said it somewhere on another journal, but I (very) rarely use the DA app on my phone, and I don't have a laptop or tablet at the moment - so I only view DA on my desktop. My beautifully large desktop which is underwhelmingly used by all those dropdown lists on the top right
Still, progress and attention to detail - its all about moving forward! To leave on a positive, I'm a fan of the new colours :3
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Glad this was useful
Let me know how you feel about it after a few days
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there's way too little swearing for that to be true...
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Your comments were actually helpful (as in I've seen a several comments that are annoy/confused by things that you've answered here that would be fine.) You guys should really consider putting some of these in the main journal so that people can calm their tits about certain things (I'm thinking: "YOU'RE KILLING MY MESSAGE CENTER", "I CAN'T DELETE FROM THE WATCH" & "THE SITE LOOKS A MESS/THE STYLE IS DIFFERENT" comments)
Here's a link to my actual comment on the journal (I've reached my edit limit so I can't change anything ignoring the things you've mentioned here): comments.deviantart.com/1/5726…
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"calm their tits " LOL
Glad what I wrote helped
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Here's my issue with what's been done. It's claimed that DA is all about the art, but all the changes seem to be about the social aspects and mimicking other successful social outlets. I hit the WATCH button on my desktop computer, (where I create my art, and upload it to DA, like I have for 7+ years as a paid user.) Once clicked, I found an image I wanted to see closer. after a couple of clicks I get this oi65.tinypic.com/1z3cy76.jpg . Now, that's as big as it appears on my 27" retina display. A monitor I specifically chose to view artwork at it's biggest and best. But what I see is an image shown almost half of it's size, while there's plenty of room for comments, and a giant blank area of screen space on either side just being wasted. Where that image lives on DA shows it's actual size oi65.tinypic.com/wj7xci.jpg which is considerably larger and utilizes more of the available space on the screen. I'm not sure I appreciate this sort of down sizing for design sake for an art site that I pay to showcase my work. Especially since the price of the site has recently been risen more than double.
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what you're seeing is both a bug and the intended function of what we're calling Peek.Let me attempt to explain...
Peek is designed to give you a fast method of browsing through your watch without spinning you into a confusing deviation page flow (like we have it now). So you get a smaller preview of the deviation page with most things arranged in an optimised way. you can still get to the deviation page from here if you want to see things super big or read comments/details in the usual way.
However, what you're *actually* seeing is a bug which constricts peek to a fixed size. We intend for this to make use of the size of your monitor, so if like yourself you're lucky enough to have a 27" monitor you're not punished. you'd see the image much larger.
So yeah, hopefully this aspect will be fixed soon!
i.
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But that's just it. Aside from design aspects, the user experience of that on a desktop computer isn't more streamlined than the original way we view artwork here. I find my self clicking just as much, if not more. It just seems like a redundancy with different colors. If it had a continuous flow, that one could swipe to peruse, then I can see that being effective and useful, but on a desktop it's cumbersome. And on a tablet it's all so small.
I'm about to renew my account here. But the fee has been more than doubled and now with all these weird changes going on, I'm having doubts. So, i'm sure you'll understand my reservations.
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I do, but I hope you see the potential the new watch has
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Working on an in-depth journal, since no comment could possibly hold all the info i'm going to dump in there. It's going to take me a couple of days, though, but this means i will be able to get used to the beta features. Be sure to read it (i know you will) – but i'm putting this out there anyway, since comments that are posted late (upwards of 24 hours) have a tendency to not get replied to at all at these hq journals.
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thanks man, sounds good. link the journal here so others can find it
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Brace yourself, man, my journal is done – and maybe too long
re: Watch 2.0
Feel free to pass it along.
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The Watch2.0 works very good , need to work more fast but in time this problem will be solved .
great job
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yeah the feature will be optimised as we go
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It would be great if the staff will add an auto-update/refresh sistem to the message center. To see live when i receive new notifications , because i have to refresh my page many times to see the new notifications .Only the numbers ... not all the info. ( you know like fb , insta ...etc.) this will be a great step .
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we've talked about push notifications. But I wonder how overwhelming that would be in your feed if you're watching a large number of very active deviants.
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Don't do it. Not only will you kill slower computers, but pushing always wastes time. This is not failbook.
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exactly.
I'd like push notifications for Notes though.
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yeah you're right , or another option is ''changing the color of the box'' just to know that i recived new notif. And of course the note box will look awesome if change the color to yellow .
Keep it up . the staff do an awesome job !
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