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AtheosEmanon — Adoption will NOT solve the abortion problem
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Published: 2012-08-15 05:35:47 +0000 UTC; Views: 11028; Favourites: 154; Downloads: 11
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Numbers are accurate as of August 15, 2012 when this was postedA common Anti-choice aka Pro-life Argument is that every person who has an abortion is selfish and just should give them up for adoption because we can adopt out all of the fetuses that are aborted...
Let us look at the numbers, shall we?
Average numbers of abortions per year in America: 1 million plus
www.guttmacher.org/pubs/fb_ind…
www.abort73.com/abortion_facts…
-abortion 73 is an anti-Abortion site, I figured if this has similar numbers to the other site no one would claim that it is biased towards pro-choicers …
Average number of adoptions per year in America: 122,000
According to the Administration for Children & Families
www.acf.hhs.gov/programs/cb/st…
This of course is on top of the 400,540 that are currently in foster care system according to the Administration for Children and Families
www.acf.hhs.gov/programs/cb/st…
As well as the 150K kids that enter the system every year permanently [the system gets 450-600k+ kids enter the foster care system every year, the bulk of these children do eventually return home after a short period of time in the system; yet 150K of them are never returned home and stay in the system:
Administration for Children & Families: www.acf.hhs.gov/programs/cb/st…
Children Rights website: www.childrensrights.org/issues…
^^Looking at just this, NOT EVEN CONSIDERING THE 400k PLUS CURRENTLY IN THE SYSTEM, if you just look at the 150K + kids who go into the system permanently EACH YEAR, vs the number of kids who are adopted out EACH year [122K], that is still a net positive number of over 28,000 kids that will go into the system and stay each year even after you deduct the number of adoptions.
While not all, many “pro life” people love to demonize people who believe a woman should have the choice as pro-abortion, which could not be further from the truth. I do not know anyone who is pro abortion in a serious way of KILL ALL FETUSES, NO MATTER WHAT. On the contrary, I believe that something should be done to decrease the numbers of unwanted pregnancies, not just abortions.
For me, I believe education is the key to all things on this.
What is it that we know? Schools that have an in depth sex education course in their curriculum, after a few years of the program being implemented had a decrease in teen pregnancy, as well as a rise on the average age that the kids have sex, [meaning both males and females wait just a bit longer before having sex]
www.plannedparenthood.org/file…
www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/…
www.guttmacher.org/pubs/FB-Tee…
www.sciencedaily.com/releases/…
I am not just speaking of sex education because what else do we know, in America? In general the more intelligent a person is, the more likely they are to family plan, as well as the more intelligent a person is in general the least amount of kids they will likely have.
www.asanet.org/press/20100223/…
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fertilit…
Everyone knows that as many of my written pieces in my gallery, suggest that education is the all to end all to address pretty much everything from decreasing number of unwanted pregnancies, to of course strengthening the education system, to decrease the number of people on welfare, as well as prison… it is a core part but is not the only part with respect to welfare and prison reform of which I may do a piece later on that.
I am not saying I am anti-adoption, in fact I believe we should try to make it easier to adopt people, by …hiring more case agents, which would lessen the case load of each agent allowing for them to do more home checks, background checks on potential parents etc
So, the point of this stamp was to somewhat comment on the other stamps that I see on here saying, ADOPT NOT ABORT!!!, where they premise their argument as if adoption will solve our abortion problem which it will not.
Let us look at facts, as previously stated we have 150K+ kids who go into the foster care permanently each year, meaning they will never return home.
We adopt out 122K kids on average..
That alone is a Net Positive of 28,000
Now, using the number above that America average 1,000,000 abortions per year.
Let us say 25% of these women chose to give their babies up for adoption [I am being modest here since I believe if abortion were illegal the real number would be around 50% ..or 500K]
Okay so that is an addition 250,000 kids that will be placed into the foster system every year so a net positive of 278,000 kids that will be in the foster care system
As well as, for many pro life people, not all, but many I see tend to be very conservative and believe we should strip the welfare program, these people are lazy but if you outlaw abortion, that will be an addition 750K kids, mostly to poor and low income people who will in turn, more than likely go on welfare… so I fail to see how this solves the problem.
The solution is not JUST how can we make the adopting process easier, it is also how do we decrease the number of unwanted pregnancies, which would include … better access to birth control for men AND women, so the pill, condoms, etc etc, and an in depth sex education class
Do you not find it a bit odd that the state, Texas, which has stripped an in depth sex education course from its Junior High School and High School curriculum has one of the fastest rising teen pregnancy rates? …. Oops. And Texas also accounts for nearly 9% of all abortions in America … double oops.
www.guttmacher.org/pubs/sfaa/t…
of 579,700 women who got pregnant in that last study only a few years ago, 15% got abortions, meaning 86,955 abortions in Texas alone… so nearly 9% of all abortions for that year and if you look at these links:
www.guttmacher.org/pubs/sfaa/t…
www.dshs.state.tx.us/chs/vstat…
So, the question remains, will we, the people, ensure that there are in depth sex education classes in schools or will we say this does not work even though we know that it does decrease pregnancy rates, and by extension abortion rates.
… though even for the teens or parents who are against abortion, decreasing pregnancy rates, which also by extension decrease the number of teens who have babies and go on welfare… so while adoption will not solve the problem with abortion… the only way to solve the issue of abortion is doing what we know decreases abortion rates.
For me the issue at hand which is more important, is pro-quality of-life. What I generally hear from many pro-lifers is OH JUST LET THE FETUS BE BROUGHT TO TERM!!! ADOPTION.. while they look at underfunded foster care system, with under paid case agents that are trying their hardest… or when the woman does have the baby and keep it, and may need some assistance they demonize her saying, YOU SHOULD NOT HAVE HAD THE BABY IF YOU COULD NOT TAKE CARE OF IT!!!!! .. or wish to cut programs to help such people, yes, welfare is what I am speaking of. Many of the new cases, are low income, women with newborn babies.
For the record, I am not anti, women on welfare, those who I speak with often know that I have some things I believe should be reformed in the welfare system to better the woman, get her more work ready etc but am not against the program in a general sense.
Here are my views on abortion in a generalized sense
Abortion pieces:
[main piece] Abortion: atheosemanon.deviantart.com/ar…
Stamps have same writing but two different stamps
Abortion stamp 1: atheosemanon.deviantart.com/ar…
Abortion stamp 2: atheosemanon.deviantart.com/ar…
Let knowledge be that truth, which portrays humanity, condemns malevolence; that respects the differences in others while abandoning the hatred and misconceptions of the past.
-Emanon
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Comments: 412
Yeah, you're probably right that they choose short term benefits over long term benefits. Reminds me of the psychological experiment done with children where they tell a child, "Here is a marshmallow. If you eat this marshmallow right now, you can't have any more of them later. But if you wait and don't eat this marshmallow right away, you will get 3 marshmallows later and you can eat all of them." And Republicans eat the marshmallow right away and then it's other people who don't get anything later ._.
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That is a great analogy, they view cuts to a programs as "savings" even if by cutting of said program that they will be spending more over the next few years.
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Alright, tough guy, put your money where your mouth is. If you'd like to do something about the low number of adoptions, why don't you encourage someone you know who wants kids to adopt one? Or, god forbid, adopt one yourself? If you have the power to solve a problem, then complaining about it doesn't get it done.
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I know plenty of people who have adopted kids.
It is less simply complaining and looking at the facts of a system at which in a system as ours, we have some of the longest waiting periods for adopts in the Western world...and pretty much across the world and that is why so many people go to foreign countries to adopt because the American process can take years to qualify.
I want no kids, so biologically or adopting I will pass.. I think my family has bred enough with over 100 first cousins and over 200 second cousins.
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Alright, if you don't want kids, that's fine. I don't care what you do so long as it doesn't impede on me.
But listen, if you're so concerned with the state of adoption, enough to post condemnations of the system, why don't you try and do something about it. When you want to lose weight, you don't lose weight by saying you're going to lose weight, you don't lose weight by saying you're going to exercise, you lose weight by exercising. Saying, "Yeah, someone should do something about that," essentially means you're delegating that responsibility to someone else to free yourself from it. It doesn't matter how hard you wish upon a star, if you don't do anything, that wish will never come true.
Here's an idea to get you started. If you encounter someone who has stated they want to have kids, even if it's a completely random stranger, why don't you suggest that they adopt? Or, how about you start a written petition to reform the adoption process to make it easier for children to find homes? And while you're doing that, you can talk about the difficulty of adoption and why this reform needs to happen so your petition has more weight when you send it to the government. Fact is, the power is in your hands, and it can't do anything if you use your hands on a mouse and keyboard.
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I do do something about it, I volunteer at the local abuse shelters, I volunteer at the adoption agencies several times a year, but I am in no government role to make congress increase funds to the system at which on that front I have written my members of congress and Senators for many years both in the US congress and state legislature. Perhaps one would do well to ask what one has done, rather than assuming one has done nothing and saying what one should do.
But thanks for your false assumptions of my negligence, it is commonplace online for people to assume many things.
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Chalk it up to past experience. I've dealt with a lot of people who only talk about the issues and not actually take action. It was wrong of me to assume you were one of them, and for that I apologize.
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pro-lifer: it doesn't matter what your reasons are, have the baby!!! all life is precious!!!
pro-lifer after the baby's born: idk chuck it in a dumpster lol
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Yeah, the Nun, Sister Joan Chittister said it best when she said
"I do not believe that just because you're opposed to abortion, that that makes you pro-life. In fact, I think in many cases, your morality is deeply lacking if all you want is a child born but not a child fed, not a child educated, not a child housed. And why would I think that you don't? Because you don't want any tax money to go there. That's not pro-life. That's pro-birth. We need a much broader conversation on what the morality of pro-life is."
www.dailykos.com/story/2015/7/…
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Oh my God, thank you for this. There it is; a valid and final argument against those pro-lifers that scream adoption every single time. Jesus, this was profound. At least some people aren't fucking retarded 
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1. I'd like to state that I've grown out of the phase of using ableist slurs such as retarded.
2. You're certainly entitled to think so.
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Thanks, I really should do a 2016 one and utilize numbers from 2015, at which the abortion numbers have gone down .. I believe we are something at just over 800K .. but the adoption numbers, as far as I know, have not that much improved
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True this. Basicly pro-life people demand women to have babies, even if raped, not ready to have one, or doesn't want one. Not only that they think this most of the time, "Women to gets an abortion = Murders" And adoption isnt going to do shit to make abortion stop.
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I support abortion if the mother's a rape victim, a minor or their life's in danger, otherwise they should give the baby up for adoption.
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For me rape and incest requires those things destruction and incineration asap children of incest and rape are freaks not deserving of life however if the child is an accident then you can take care of the child and if you do have the money then you should take care of your child.
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Agreed, it also amazes me that many of them, not all but many are against contraception .. so you are against the very thing made to decrease pregnancy thus create less of a need for abortion hmm
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The pro life people who demand a child be born are only kidding themselves. While some kids will be adopted, other's won't and they obviously never heard or don't want to hear the stories of how many kids were abused in the system and had to go to counseling afterwards and how some of them ended up dead as a result. They want the child born but won't do anything to help it or the mother if it's born in poverty or the mother hates the child, so what they are doing is not only taking the woman's right away they are also contributing to child abuse by forcing an unwanted child to be born in a situation where it will be hungry at night, abused by its parents or people in the system when they won't help the child but wanted it to be born.
If they are pro life, they will help ALL kids have a chance at life, don't say "The baby should have a chance to live a happy life!" and not help that child achieve that goal after it's born and walk away from it. So either they help or they need to mind their own business and let the woman make the choice.
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I agree that pass being against abortion that they do not think through what happens after that. Be it the great costs of several hundred thousand new foster kids in a system that already does not have enough funds.. or the scenarios you outlined of abuse that goes on in many cases in the foster care system, etc.
Fully agree with your second part as well, the people who say we should have no abortion, are usually, not always, the same people who then want to cut education, welfare, etc - - which makes no sense at all.
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Exactly, they say abortion is murder when abortion has been around since the beginning of time, women jumping from trees to cause a miscarriage, from making herbal tea and eating plants like tansy and unripen papaya's to use as contraceptions or abort a pregnancy. And most of the pro life women had abortions themselves but won't say anything and say their abortion was for a good reason while the other women who get abortions are sluts, oh and that reminds me of a story I heard where a pregnant woman was abused by her boyfriends who dropped her off at an abortion clinic and instead of the protesters helping her when she wanted the child, they still called her a baby killer and whore.
Exactly, Republicans want live babies to raise them to be dead soldiers, future prisoners for their cooperations or if they are girls future brew mares. And some of the pro life people just want to feel noble and some hate women and say pregnancy is a punishment. And you know whats funny? They say children are a blessing but keep saying the child is a punishment for sex, they are literally calling that child who they want to save a punishment.
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www.biblegateway.com/passage/?…
They claim to be readers of the bible, I guess they forgot about this.. in the bible if a man believes that his wife has cheated, god says [as an atheist this amuses me] that there is a special concoction that you give to your wife and if she cheated.. it will cause her to have a miscarriage.. in essence.. in the bible god says if your wife cheated.. this will cause her to have an abortion yet .. they seem to have no issue with that hmm..
yes, Many people, women, even if they have not had abortions, also utilize contraception to stop pregnancies because of usually unmarried sex at which their faith say is also wrong
I want to decrease the number of abortions, hell it would be amazing if there were never an unwanted pregnancy or that there was never an instance where the life of the mother was threatened but we do not live in that world
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I remember that passage, it just goes to show how people can be hypocrites. To me it's always been about blind faith, ego and power.
People were smart back then and yet the protesters want to ban contraception to avoid the unwanted pregnancy. It's about sex deprive because they are frustrated they can't do that out of fear of pregnancy and what their religion states, especially anti women people who don't see kids as gifts but punishments. And I have a theory that while they repeat life is sacred, they are scared because they could have been aborted themselves, fearing their own existence, and believes they are doing that kid a favor.
Same here.
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Of course, many people pick and choose what parts, if any, of their religious texts that they will follow.
That is the only part that makes no sense, contraception would lead to less pregnancies and thus less abortions so ... if they want less abortions one would think that they would be in favor of contraception being made easily available.
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Precisely, and it also says that life begins at first breath in the bible when god created Adam, so it doesn't begin at conception, and it's like my mother and grandmother say "Your days are numbered on the day you are born," because that's when you are now fully alive.
They want to control sex and they are mostly unhappy themselves if they have kids they don't want. And abortion will never truly go away because while pro life people and republicans are against it, they will secretly get an abortion themselves or help their mistress have an abortion or provide abortions for their wives or daughters if raped.
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I just had someone comment me saying abortion should be stopped because there are people who will adopt it eh ... and their page says they are against abortion 100% in all cases eh . while I understand someone being against abortion, I cannot get the 100% no matter what so if the mother's life is in danger then who cares? force her to have it? and who really wants to force a rape victim to carry her rapist's baby if they do not want to?.. eh ..
I believe it should remain legal, and will never support any absolute ban no matter what of it.
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Especially if it ruins both the mother and child's life. And not everyone is going to adopt the child, the person who is against it 100% should see the news all the babies, toddlers and kids murdered, abused and are living on the streets by both biological parents AND adoptive parents, they don't like the idea of an abortion but they won't have the stomach to see the reality that the baby might not have the happy ending that person wants it, because the mother could die and leave the baby motherless, the mother hates the child and abuses it and have no relationship or love between them with the mother screaming "I WISH YOU WERE NEVER BORN!", it's in foster care and it might be abused by other kids who have serious issues, the workers or the foster parents.
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yes, of the 2 million people waiting to adopt that the person cited, that is from a 1988 survey and of that 2 million, 1.3 million never adopted and no longer wanted to..
I have been a rape crisis counselor and it vexes me when anyone would say they would make the choice and force the person to carry their rapist's baby to term..
Same thing with life of the mother, if the woman makes the choice that let her baby be born even if it kills her that is one thing but for someone to make that choice for her, especially if it is against her will.. just no..
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Adoption will always be a slippery slope, whether people want to hear it or not.
The people who would force a woman to carry a child against her will disgust me and are monsters. And if that baby is unloved and because of them forcing the mother to have it when she never wanted it, I hope they end up feeling guilty to where it eats them inside knowing they forced that poor child into the world where it will never be loved by its mom and beaten and left out in the cold and will always be sad and depressed. They hate the idea of abortion, it's like I said they need to see news reports of the babies, toddlers and kids who were abused and killed by parents who never wanted them. I don't understand why they are so desperate for a baby to be born regardless of the mother's circumstances and yet won't do anything else to help those kids.
Then the person who forces her to have the child better sign those adoption papers and start buying it clothes, food, pay for it's schooling and look after it for eighteen years, because if she can't back out of the pregnancy because that person forces her to have it, then that person is asking to be the parent because the mother won't raise the child she doesn't want.
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I am pro adoption, I am not pro .. hey there are some people who want to adopt so .. BAN ALL ABORTIONS...
Agree with your entire second post..
Then there is this issue
www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/01…
www.cnn.com/2013/08/01/us/rapi…
in 31 States in America a rapist can sue their victim for custody rights.. so they force the woman to have the baby, if she chooses after they forced her to keep the baby.. in most States her rapist can then sue her custody rights meaning for the next 18 years her rapist may be in her life...
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Same here.
I heard of that and it's disgusting, and whats worse is that if the rapist receives right they can victimize the woman all over again ad probably rape her again during a visit, or the child might end up being raped by the father or witness its father rape someone else and traumatize it and probably murder it or kidnap it and hold it hostage. Not only will allowing the rapist rights ruin the woman's life it can ruin the child's life.
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Or turn the child against the victim or many other things, I do not think these people have fully thought out their positions but if they say ban all abortions no matter what, hopefully they would agree that a rapist should not be able to sue for custody rights.. but I believe many of them would say NO!! HE HAS A RIGHT TO SEE HIS CHILD!!!!!
(I say he because while there are female rapists, it is unlikely that a woman would rape a man and if she did not want the baby would then seek the man out and all of that so .. it is more likely to be males
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Idiots! All of them! They don't care about the mother and they just proved they don't care about the child.
There was a story about a woman who raped a guy and got pregnant and now he has to pay child support...it pisses me off.
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umm.. she just said that "abortion also makes things easier for rapists, as it makes them feel like they can rape a woman without worrying about being responsible for an unplanned pregnancy: they assume the woman can have an abortion and forget them."
so all of those rapes before abortion was legal was ONLY because they knew it was illegal and she would be forced to have their child? makes no sense...
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What that person doesn't realize is that if you are in a state where abortion is illegal it WILL be hard for the woman.
.............
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Just check it out, you do not have to comment but just read
comments.deviantart.com/1/1557…
the entire arguments are from anti abortion websites. not really shocking but.. it appears we will soon agree to disagree or this will go on for a few months
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I had to stop reading after a few comments because my blood started boiling.
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yeah, I was like..wait what but in her last response she said she wanted to agree to disagree so I guess it is now over..
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Thank goodness.
But yes, when they make those statements saying "You must have that baby conceived from rape!" I would LOVE to see them explain it to a child who was abused, in foster care or was born from rape and how they made their mother have those kids.
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I used to be a rape crisis counselor, some women did choose to keep the kids and are happy, some chose to have an abortion and are happy.. that for me is the main thing, that it is their choice
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Exactly, it will always be their choice whether people like it or not. And nothing can change that.
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Some people do not want them to have a choice.
Look at that sad, 10 year old girl in Paraguay .. they have that abortion is illegal unless life of the mother is in danger so a 10 year old girl was made to have her stepfather's child after the stepfather repeatedly raped her.
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I heard about that story
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I am sure it will figure it out on its own by seeing that its mother is only 11 years older than it is.. so when that child is 20 their mother will be 31 .. just..damn..
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I can't imagine how it will effect the child. The mother suffered a lot but that child will know how it's born and that its mother could have died having it...their government is awful!
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Yup, I wonder if she will give it up for adoption .. and if her mother is still with the man who raped her daughter...
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