HOME | DD
Creshosk — Crash Course - Genetics
Published: 2011-07-31 19:50:43 +0000 UTC; Views: 15242; Favourites: 193; Downloads: 564
Redirect to original
Description
Continuation of the Lesson on Alicorn OCs Part 1:[link] .Full Pinkie Pie vector by
Fluttershy Vector by
Doctor Whooves Vector by
Filly Celestia and Filly Luna picture by
Well this has certainly pissed the trolls off. :iconthundercrashshrug: I'm okay with that. I knew that it would. So what the matter trolls? U mad?
It's hilarious that some people are ACTUALLY arguing:
Paraphrased: "You cant do things that are non-canon, but I can."
They must be getting really pissed off.
Apparently I pissed of a Nazi calling themself "JessicaBlood" into "trolling" me. Haha...
They didn't understand the basic concept of multiversal theory when laid out for them... course nobody ever said nazi's were bright.
And the idiots are still letting me troll them. It's hilarious. :trollfacplz:
Related content
Comments: 237
Barring the ludicrousy of saying that canon doesn't matter, I will address your other points.
In canon there has been no other pony with a black coat other than Luna. Should we assume then that your pony is an all powerful god gary stu because the only pony we saw Was one of the goddesses? Or do we in a given fanon override canon with what's observed?
I'm a fan of letting fans do what they want in their own fanons and saying that it happened in another reality where that's possible for it to have happened.
I did not say that one can not do things that are non-canon. So you didn't say that canon overrides fanon?
You will never write him into canon because you can't you don't have exacutive crative decision over which timestream the show follows.
However you will write him into your own personal fanon even if its just a thousand words with a picture. Beautiful pictures mind you.
Where have you seen a black coated pony other than Luna and the shadow bolts?
*shrugs* And still I love your BS fanfics. and will defend them as having the right to exist just as much as anything else a fan comes up with. I didn't like the taste of "Cupcakes" but it exists within it's own continuity, its own reality. Just as your pony OC does just as your fanfics do.
Baby surprise isnt a MLP:FiM canon character, neither are the OC Alicorns. Yet its possible for them to exist within a reality separate from MlP:FiM
MlP:FiM itself is non-canon with the g1 canon, nor is it canon with "fanon".
Canon refers to a given continuity. Just as with the x-men comics, cartoons and movies are all non-canon to each other they are all canon to themselves.
There is a comib book canon
A cartoon canon
and a movie canon
The timeline of events in each is separate from one another.
Canon cannot simply refer to "the official thing" as Jubilee being orphaned being adopted by non-mutant american parents is canon to the 90s cartoon but not canon to the comics.
You cannot simply say whether the event was canon or non-canon. As it was both and neither.
This means that none of it is within continuity of each other, which means that they are not in the same universe.
That seems to be where a problem lies with the terms being used.
I've grown up with different canons, or continuities of various different mediums, be it Mario, sonic, ninja turtles, and especially comic books where there are alternate universes within the comics. Marvel comics was kind enough to give us designations based on the month and year that the designation was established. The mainstream comics being 616.
👍: 0 ⏩: 1
Luna has a Royal Violet coat(as based on copic marker colors), the only pony with a black coat has been Nightmare Moon. My OC has an ash grey coat. Derpy/Ditzy has a light grey coat, Zecora of course has white and black. The shadow bolt manifestations created by NMM were also darkcoated. The creation of an avatar, in the design of my oc, in order to interact with other ponysonas does not make it an attempt to override canon, especially since it follows the rules laid out by canon.
You are a fan of letting people do what they want with their ideas.
Fanon has to be widely accepted to be called fanon.
Lyra is fanon.
Bon-Bon is fanon.
Derpy/Ditzy is fanon.
Aquarius (My OC) and Crash Course are not Fanon.
By writing him into canon I mean that I will never write a story where he was a member of the winter wrap-up team or that he followed the mane cast to everfree castle. There are many who do that, thus attempting to override canon.
Canon as defined by the World English Dictionary: a list of writings, officially recognized as genuine.
Wikipedia defines it as: material accepted as "official" in a fictional universe's fan base.
Choosing to use your own definition does not make your points any more valid.
There seems to be a theme of you saying that what you say is right merely because you are capable of saying it.
👍: 0 ⏩: 1
"Choosing to use your own definition does not make your points any more valid.
"
How highly hypocritical of you.
[link]
[link]
[link]
Quick definitions from WordNet (fanon)
▸ noun: Striped scarf worn by the Pope at mass
Since none of those ponies are clothing worn by the pope. They are not the actual definition of Fanon.
[link]
And I'm aware of the portementau of Fan+canon
Since I am one person then my canon, my writings as a fan would be a fanon.
Sorry. But if you're going to get picky about it then I'll get technical about it.
👍: 0 ⏩: 0
I do. Clearly you do not. Calling anothers work by a negative trait is an attack. The use of the Term "Gary Stu" Clearly demonstrates a hostile intent.
Clearly you do not know the difference.
👍: 0 ⏩: 0
Oh my... XD I'm sorry to say, but that's not trolling. There's a difference between helpful feedback and trolling. Lailah is only trying to help you. c: She's trying to explain that the past generations are not the same as the new ones since the new one is a different story entirely.
There's a difference between trolling and feedback.
👍: 0 ⏩: 1
Which is what the first half explained. Her intent is quite obviously not to help but to harass.
👍: 0 ⏩: 1
Excuse me, but if I may ask, where do you get the idea that she is harassing you? I have seen no name-calling, no provoking of a fight, or trying to disturb you on purpose. The only thing I've seen of her is trying to explain to you the flaws in your genetics. I know Lailah personally and I know she would never troll someone unless she thinks that they seriously deserved it. The only thing I've seen her do is try to help you, and she can't explain herself if you keep continuing to block her. And I know she's read the first half as well.
Plus, um...I'm no genetic expert, but I do know the part with Dinky is wrong. You're supposed to get 50% of your mother and father's genes. Not just random percentages. c: I hope that helps a bit.
👍: 0 ⏩: 2
Did you look at the numbers at all? She's gotten 50% of her pony traits from her mother and 50% from her father. And I know that you get 50% from each. I said that on the first line.
👍: 0 ⏩: 1
It's not possible using the genetic model he has for two parents of different species to have a child under the third species. *math talk time* In order to be a particular species you need at least 33% of that specie's traits. This means that you need at least 16.5% from your parents. If your parent has 16.5% of a species then they'll be that species, not another species. If you make it so that one of the parents has a percentage less then that, then the other parent has to have more to compensate. This, again, means that parent would be that species.
👍: 0 ⏩: 1
They're not incompatible spieces. Even Lauren Faust said there was no reason they couldn't "Mix it up".
I'm only referring to a smaller portion of the DNA, as clearly not all pegasai are the same cclor, nor do they all have the same mannerisms or genetic predispositions. This is reffering only to a specific set.
And actually humans are 98% similar to Chimpanzees and are not genetically compatible.
Since they can "mix it up" then they are more similar to each other than man is to chimp while the human and the chimp share a 98% of their total DNA.
👍: 0 ⏩: 0
Calling my character a "gary stu" indicates a hostile intent. It was clear to me that from that point she was an obvious troll.
If she wishes to try to be helpful, she'd do well to curb the hostility. Even if she thinks he's a gary stu it would be best to not call it that. That is quite clearly a negative trait association.
👍: 0 ⏩: 1
Soooo....We're not allowed to call people Stus or Sues because that's hostile? ....Mmmmkay. I still don't think she was being hostile or a troll at all. She was merely trying to help you, but whatever. I'll stop trying to reason with you, now. You're probably busy doing whatever and frankly, I'm a bit busy with things, too.
Good day, and I hope you get the genetic problem sorted out. c:
👍: 0 ⏩: 1
I'm not sure if you're aware of this, but Gary Stu and Mary Sue have negative connotations to it.
"Are we not alloowed to call people idiots? ....Mmmmkay."
She was not addressing the genetics at all, she was attacking the quantum mechanics by using a stolen concept fallacy.
Tha'ts not helpful.
👍: 0 ⏩: 1
I am very aware of what Gary Stu and Mary Stu means. I think you have blown this out of proportion. Excuse me if that sounds rude, but just because one little term rubs you the wrong way, that does not mean it is trolling.
👍: 0 ⏩: 1
It indicates a hostile intent. Have I not been clear on this matter?
If the intent is hostile, then clearly it is NOT to be helpful.
👍: 0 ⏩: 0
Hey, I've got an important question : Where do zebras and merponies fit in with THOSE genetics ?
👍: 0 ⏩: 2
Just FYI: I was joking. I perfectly understood that this was about ponies (the three kinds of them) and that the rest was other species, even if those two kinds are probably related. I also have seen another brony do a study on pony genetics. For him, it was a pair of alleles that were responsible for the pony subspecies. Each of the three variation was dominant against one and recessive against another. An example : you could have a pegasus that had an earth pony allele (E) because that allele acted recessive with a pegasus allele (P), but the child of a pure earth pony (EE) and a part-unicorn earth pony (UE) would always be an earth pony, no mather what kind of allele he got (UE or EE) because "earth pony" is dominant against "unicorn".
👍: 0 ⏩: 2
Saw that too, it formed the starting point for me pondering pony genetics. Though since the allele's don't work in a rock, paper scissors fashion, I thought what if there are differing amounts?
👍: 0 ⏩: 0
Also, the "alicorn" allele would be always recessive. Two carrier of the "alicorn" allele would be needed to make baby alicorns. If alicorns give birth to baby alicorns more often, well, epigenetics might explain that. Something in the parent alicorn forces the activity of the "alicorn" gene and foals with that allele, even only one, are alicorns ? I dunno, lol, I'm just horseappling my way into an explanation.
👍: 0 ⏩: 0
Merponies haven't been seen in mlp yet and as twilight said zebra's are not ponies. This only covers a small part of a single species genetic markers. This is all super simplified.
👍: 0 ⏩: 1
So this means that we won't see Zecora and Twilight's beautiful stripy baby ponies ? So sad, so sad...
👍: 0 ⏩: 1
I never said that. I've seen the offspring of Spike and Rarity depicted in fanart. And I could provide you with links to scientific research documenting fertalizing an egg without a male cell.
In some alternate reality its possible that that happened.
👍: 0 ⏩: 0
It makes sense, but what did you base the percentages for Pinkie Pie and Fluttershy off of?
👍: 0 ⏩: 1
Just observations of the show. Fluttershy's relatively high unicorn is due to the staremaster, and pinkie . . . Well I can name the spells she casts including armor bizzare in dragonshy her teleporting to beat dash. To places and popping up out of nowhere. She's also rather bouncy so has a bit of pegasus in her.
👍: 0 ⏩: 1
I don't think the stare would count as a unicorn spell since we haven't seen any other examples of it in canon. She might have some unicorn in her since we haven't seen her parents, but if she lived in Cloudsdale as a child that'd probably mean both of her parents were pegasus because they'd fall through the clouds otherwise.
As for Pinkie, I wouldn't think of those as species traits so much as Pinkie being Pinkie. If she did have pegasus or unicorn in her, then why is it that both her parents and two siblings are earth ponies? Not only earth ponies but very pure earth ponies if we're using the traits you listed as indicators of species. Pinkie wouldn't get those species traits out of nowhere, after all. It wouldn't be something that she and she alone would exhibit since species isn't exactly a recessive gene.
👍: 0 ⏩: 1
You think teleportation is just pinkie being pinkie? I'm sure both twilights from g1 and g4 would disagree with you. Do I really need to point out where dinky received some non-unicorn dna from her parents and point out the nordic and irish sects of humans as to carrying a prominant reccesive trait?
👍: 0 ⏩: 1
Again, G1 is a different continuity then G4 so you can't use evidence from it to back up your arguments.
Also, there is no canon evidence whatsoever that Dinky, Derpy and Dr. Whooves are related. That is fanon. If you're going to use canon to support your arguments then you can't throw in things like "Dinky is a unicorn and Derpy is a pegasus." How do you know that Dinky's father couldn't be a pegasus? How do you know that they're even related? It is, again, fanon.
If you can find a way to make the numbers work so that two obviously earth ponies are able to have two obviously earth pony children and a third one that exhibits unicorn and pegasus traits as you claim Pinkie Pie does, then you'll be onto something.
👍: 0 ⏩: 1
Is it that you people didn't understand the first part?
👍: 0 ⏩: 1
No, I read the first part. Your basis that there should be other alicorns is based on animation errors and a different continuity entirely. If we're taking animation errors into account then I could argue that ponies are able to change their species due to the fact that a background pony named Lyra has been seen without her unicorn horn in some scenes.
Also, "It's an alternate universe, I can do whatever the hell I want" isn't an argument. Cupcakes is an alternate universe fanfiction. That doesn't make it anymore likely to be canon then alicorns outside of the royal family. If you want an alicorn OC, okay, fine. But it won't happen in canon and if you try to justify it happening in canon then it is still a Stu.
👍: 0 ⏩: 1
I didn't ask if youd read it, I asked if you'd understood it. Which quite clearly you have not.
Of course its not "canon" g1 is not in Canon with g4 and vice versa. And yes actually, doing things in an alternate universe does allow people to do what ever they want. Because its in a different "canon" or "continuity" from the regular show.
That was the point of the first one. G1 had alicorns in it, G4 only has two. Should I look in your gallery and get on your case for presenting ANYTHING that didn't happen in the show? Any piece of fanart of any of the characters that was not seen in the show is not in continuity.
You are aware of that aren't you? Both the positive and the negative fan works are not in continuity. So youre allowed to do whatever you want that's not in canon, but other people can't?
And you accuse me of bias? That's funny.
👍: 0 ⏩: 1
The first part presented some alicorn examples from other generations and argued that due to the number of multiverses it's possible to do anything. Seems simple enough. What exactly am I not getting?
But the point is that if it's not canon or in the same continuity as the show then you cannot present it as if it is. Alicorns are not canon in G4 outside of Celestia, Luna, and possibly other members of their royal family. If you fail to abhere to this canon then you will be called out on it. Referring to my earlier example of Cupcakes, why do you think people got in such a tizzy about it? Because it violated canon by showing Pinkie as a crazy sadistic serial killer. That's not canon and neither are alicorns.
"Should I look in your gallery and get on your case for presenting ANYTHING that didn't happen in the show? Any piece of fanart of any of the characters that was not seen in the show is not in continuity."
XD Oh and you accuse Lailah of trolling? Yes, waste time going through my gallery (which, by the way, contains little to no My Little Pony fanart outside of one Luna humanization) when you instead could be spending that time responding to questions other commenters and myself have asked such as...
1. How would Pinkie Pie's genetics work with her family? Do you have numbers?
2. Do your numbers even work at all? You inherit half of your parents traits, not a random percentage of them. Based on this Dinky would actually be 31% unicorn, 37.5% earth pony, and 31.5% pegasus, not the numbers you have.
"You are aware of that aren't you? Both the positive and the negative fan works are not in continuity. So youre allowed to do whatever you want that's not in canon, but other people can't?"
You are allowed to do whatever you want. That doesn't mean you're excused from being called out on it. Like I said, if you violate the canon then people WILL call you out on it, and instead of responding to it by accusing the person of trolling or blocking their accounts, you should try and accept their criticisms.
👍: 0 ⏩: 1
"Due to the number of multiverses"
No. IT'd be due to the number of UNIverses. The MLP Multiverse contains all of the MLP Universes. Including generations 1-4. Those alternate universes are within the same multiverse, but different universes and thus different continuitys or "canon"s. The events of one world are not 100% identical to those of a parellel universe. However they are similar. Both generation 3, 3.5 and 4 have had an antity named "Rainbow Dash" however this is not the same "Rainbow Dash". They would be alternate reality versions of one another. But separated far enough that they contain only a few trace similarities.
"
But the point is that if it's not canon or in the same continuity as the show then you cannot present it as if it is."
And this is something else your'e not getting. The point of the first was to show that
"In alternate realities the amino acids might react differently, giveing different retroviruses, resulting in a modifiaction of the evolutionary tree yeilding different spiecces. Including worlds where Alicorn's are common place."
Did you read it this time? You seemed to have missed it or misunderstood it from the last time. Which further proves you did NOT understand the first half, and thus none of your argument is well informed. Sorry, but without the vital key pieces of information your argument has no foundation. As I'm not presenting this as "canon" as I quite clearly said "in alternate universes".
👍: 0 ⏩: 1
"No. IT'd be due to the number of UNIverses. The MLP Multiverse contains all of the MLP Universes. Including generations 1-4. Those alternate universes are within the same multiverse, but different universes and thus different continuitys or "canon"s. The events of one world are not 100% identical to those of a parellel universe. However they are similar. Both generation 3, 3.5 and 4 have had an antity named "Rainbow Dash" however this is not the same "Rainbow Dash". They would be alternate reality versions of one another. But separated far enough that they contain only a few trace similarities."
Oh, you're right on this one. My apologies, I did use the wrong word.
"Did you read it this time? You seemed to have missed it or misunderstood it from the last time. Which further proves you did NOT understand the first half, and thus none of your argument is well informed. Sorry, but without the vital key pieces of information your argument has no foundation. As I'm not presenting this as "canon" as I quite clearly said "in alternate universes"."
I assumed that genetics would be a constant in all of these alternate realities but it appears not to be the case.
Going to your example of two different species having a child of the third species, this is impossible given ordinary genetics. I apologize for breaking out math, but I must.
First, we define X as the percentage of a species that parent 1 has and Y as the percentage of a species that 2 has.
In order for a child to be a particular species they must have more then 33% of that species trait. Given this, we can derive a formula that states,
(X/2) + (Y/2) = or is greater than 33%.
If we plug this equation into a graphing calculator or something of that sort then we'll see that there are three possible solutions, with these being:
X > 33%
Y > 33%
or X=Y=33%
However, all three of these solutions would require the parent to be a member of the third species.
/math explanation
If you are going to "mix it up" as Lauren Faust said then why bother with the explanation at all? This long explanation you have involving multiverses and universes and alternate realities and genetics working differently and everything is incorrect in logic, math, genetics, and frankly makes you seem like a bit of a troll what with the "deal with it" part you have at the end.
Your explanation that Lauren Faust has said that it is acceptable to mix it up is a vast improvement to what you currently have. If you reply to any questions with that, it will show that you have actually done your research and should, for the most part, keep criticism and even trolling to a minimum due to the fact that it is somewhat canon via word of god.
👍: 0 ⏩: 1
If the genetics were the same in all of them there would have been no baby surprise alicorn in ANY of them. More to the point there wouldn't be anything other than the way genetics occurs in THIS universe. But since other realities have such facinating creatures that do not occur in this one, that can't be the case.
And multiverse is simply a categorical classification rather than a hard physical one. As you get over lap in the form of crossovers.
And your numbers are off. We share a 98% similarity in our total DNA tochimpanzees, but cannot gentically engieneer any monkey men. However this part that I addressed is not the total genetic makeup and only addresses the DNA that determines what type of pony would result. As I explained in part one there could be other worlds that had a retrovirus that creates a fourth potential type of common pony. Like baby Surprise in the MLPG1 universe.
But again this is only discussing non-canon mlp universes. The only ones that can have ANY kind of OC. As your OC (general use of the word you) will more than likely never make it into an official show. So An OC only exists in an alternate reality and none of their actions will have an effect. more than likely.
I have to put uncertianfiers as its actually possible for this fansdom to have an effect on the continuity. Looke at the worlds most beloved animation error. Good ol Derpy.
I wonder if knowing that the fandom can have an effect is a partial motivator for the hatred toward OCs. They don't want to see anyone other than their own OC show up. But that's a rather negative interpritation of the behaviors of the herd rather than a favorable one. But it is hard to interpret negativity favorably.
👍: 0 ⏩: 1
"If the genetics were the same in all of them there would have been no baby surprise alicorn in ANY of them. More to the point there wouldn't be anything other than the way genetics occurs in THIS universe. But since other realities have such facinating creatures that do not occur in this one, that can't be the case."
Exactly. Because there WOULD be no alicorns outside of the royal family. With Celestia and Luna it seems to be either a case of genetics that exist only in the royal family line or magic. I personally think the second explanation makes more sense as it would also explain their immortality.
"And your numbers are off. We share a 98% similarity in our total DNA tochimpanzees, but cannot gentically engieneer any monkey men. However this part that I addressed is not the total genetic makeup and only addresses the DNA that determines what type of pony would result. As I explained in part one there could be other worlds that had a retrovirus that creates a fourth potential type of common pony. Like baby Surprise in the MLPG1 universe."
It is possible for some different species to cross breed with viable off spring though. An example of this is a donkey and a horse creating a mule. Given the fact that there was a mule briefly shown on the show it's also possible that this is the same in Equestria as in our world.
"I have to put uncertianfiers as its actually possible for this fansdom to have an effect on the continuity. Looke at the worlds most beloved animation error. Good ol Derpy."
I very much doubt that fandom will influence canon to the point of introducing alicorn characters outside of those that would be related to Celestia and Luna. Even then, Prince Blueblood is related to the two (albeit in a very small way) and he's only a unicorn.
"I wonder if knowing that the fandom can have an effect is a partial motivator for the hatred toward OCs. They don't want to see anyone other than their own OC show up. But that's a rather negative interpritation of the behaviors of the herd rather than a favorable one. But it is hard to interpret negativity favorably."
I don't think people create OCs with the intent of having them on the show. If that applies for you personally then I would highly recommend a slice of humble pie. I very much doubt that this is the case but still feel that this must be said.
The reason fandom was able to influence things was because of the sheer magnitude of support behind it. In Derpy's case, people liked her. I don't see a lot of support for Alicorn characters.
On another note, why do you assume Lailah and I have original characters? If you looked through our galleries as you said you would then you'd see that our fanart consists of the humanized Luna in my case (hardly an OC, simply the character in a different drawing style), or her characters in the style. Neither of us have written fanfiction or have drawn characters interacting with canon characters.
If you're going to accuse us of such things then at least check your facts first. XD
👍: 0 ⏩: 1
But clealrly the genetics do not work the exact same in all of the MLP universes, baby Surprise for example was an alicorn that was not a goddess. The fact that there are MLP at all indicates that genetics don't work 100% the same in all the universes in the omniverse. However we do use our own as a basis foundation to fillin whatever gaps we see in the alternate universes, and using what ever observations we make as an override for our own laws of physics. However you san't throw everything out the window as gravity still seems to be in effect as indicated by fluttershy if nothing else and some of the laws of thermal dynamics as Rainbow dash indicated the air gets colder the higher up you go.
So it'd be fallacy to discard everything just as much as it would be to say that everything is the same.
And there are spiecies of salamanders that are incapable of breeding with each other.
So then I wonder why all the hostility toward OCs. In particular OCs from alternate universes where the laws of that universe are not 100% the same as the manestream one?
No, I'm under no illusions of any of my Fanon making it into canon. Id much perfer not, that way I can keep working on it without further needless complications.
As I said before ... I was using "you" in a general sense as a term for anyone who has an OC. As there are others that are far more hostile than you or your friend. though your friend exhibited far more prejudicial hatred than you have.
I have no idea why either of you have exhibited any level of hostility. Have I ever portrayed Crash as being perfect? I've said he's limited to three spells, far less than twilight, Rainbow Dash is faster. But at the same time there are a few talents he's best at. He can play the thunderdrums better than some of the canon characters. So he's not an anti-stu nor is he a gary stu. Simply because he's an alicorn is a poor excuse, as I've explianed that he comes from an MLP universe where the genetics work the way I've indicated. As they are rather similar to the Genetics of this world as well.
And remember that pegasai and unicorns and earth ponies are more like each other than they are to donkeys.
👍: 0 ⏩: 0
I give this science presentation A, for Alicorn.
Still don't want to see TOO many more of them, but a couple more are always good.
👍: 0 ⏩: 0
My mind = blown.
I can't believe you actually explained genetics in such a simple way. Being interested in medicine, I have a mediocre understanding of genetics and I can say without a doubt that all of this makes complete sense. You must've spent quite a while on this. Instant favorite.
👍: 0 ⏩: 0
I'm gonna use this for my science exam...
👍: 0 ⏩: 0
Oh my gosh... Dude...
This is amazingly well thought out.
Holy crap, I'm totally gonna share this with people (credit to you of course.)
Well done bro, up til now I've kinda been against alicorn OC's... but I CANNOT ARGUE WITH SCIENCE!!!!!
👍: 0 ⏩: 0
As a Biomajor I gotta say I'm impressed and loving this XD
👍: 0 ⏩: 1
If you want to use any of this even just the root idea in any of your school work feel free to. All I ask is showing me after its been turned in and the like.
I'm amused by the idea of using MLP stuff as serious application to such things. And wouldn't mind seeing how that turns out.
👍: 0 ⏩: 1
Haha well I already took genetics but I may show this to some of my friends who are going to go into that class.
👍: 0 ⏩: 0
<= Prev |