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LoreC10 — Natural borders of France
#chauvinism #france #french #nationalism #rhine #naturalborders
Published: 2015-09-22 22:22:17 +0000 UTC; Views: 4277; Favourites: 29; Downloads: 10
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Description
a new deviation inspired by two discussion that i had recently with and some month ago with about natural borders of France, and , yes also made to trollnatural borders follow in counterclockwise from the mouth of Rhine, the English Channel coast, the atlantic coast of France, the pyrenean water divide, the French mediterranean coast, the main western alpine water divide, beginning from Roya river basin, after, it goes for a few kilometers on the Rhine-Rhône water divide line until being near Reuss river spring, there the border follows this river until it gets in the Aare that it follows before meeting the Rhine river, the borders follows the Rhine until its mouth.
This border includes millions of germans and Germanics. Especially in Switzerland, there could be some alternative to "save some german speaker" but the borderline should change river from one to another not mutually contiguous and that would compromise a lot the "geographicity" of the border
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Comments: 40
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That's my dream, but it misses something...hmm...hmm...something called "Vallée d'Aoste" or something like that. Good flag map anyway !
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this is not a map of greater France, it is a map of GEOGRAPHICAL France, "Vallée d'Aoste" is not part of it, because it is located on the Italian side of the Alpine main water divide, besides, I don't know if you spotted it, but it miss even some more territories on franco-italian border which belong today to France and that are on our side of Alps (Roya river valley, mongenève, moncenis and vallée étroite)
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You could have chose the Sarine+Aar for divide in "Helvetia"
Also, back off jacobinists centralists Scum
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Yes, but then Rhône river high basin (Valais canton) would look like an extreme tip of France in nothing
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But who really want valaisans in their Country, who ?
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I guess...euh...I've no idea ^^
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So you would give away Corsica to pursuit the objective of natural borders? ^^
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Says the italian...
Chiaro, me ne frego della Corsica, che sono terroristi independentisti
All in all our natural borders are way more important than some island, however beautiful it is
But I don't want to hear you going about Savoy and Nice though... A gift is a gift, to take it back is stealing.
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Personally I mind for Savoy and Nice as much as you care for Corsica, they are culturally and geographically yours, they should stay in France
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Héhé nice map, but you don't need to worry about Germanics, you could imagine an alternate history 
And eastern Switzerland use to be Rhaeto-romance at the same era
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oh, i knew about Treviri/Trèves that stayed a romance speaking island in a sea of germans for a lot, but never knew anything about Berne, now the dots are begging to connect that's why Romansh could be so extended at the beginning of middle age and also similar to French, i'm beginning to visualize the medieval linguistic map of Switzerland, thank you for this information
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Arminius upload a map of the progression of the germanization in medieval central Europe here if you want : arminius1871.deviantart.com/ar…
However germanization didn't means end of romances languages, there was probably a bilingual period with Romances minorities even when Germans became the majority
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i see, yeah that's possible -sic transit gloria mundi, thus passes the glory of the world- situation evolve, history goes on, peoples move and cultures change, that's fascinating how history could seem a force of the nature, a powerful river, unstoppable and untamable
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Yes, sometime I wonder how would look like the next nations in the world. Some state have a very weak demography (Romania & Bulgaria) and I wonder if their nations will survive their migration to the West, a small population could be assimilated easily by a huge migration.
I sometime wonder how the USA would look like when Spanish speakers will be the majoritary in the South-West.
How the Eurozone will implode and what will be the next European project
Etc, etc ^^ ...
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I wonder, which "huge nations are you talking about" for the case of Bulgaria and Romania?
Sometimes I wonder about Spanish in US too, I don't know if they could be assimilated, US assimilated many national groups in the past. But, never forget that Daddy died because he couldn't stand migrations anymore, in 3/4 centuries he managed to assimilate them but then he wasn't in degree anymore, and so, as the greatest power in the world, he felt. Comparation to US, and I believe to Europe too, are evident, and many words that we find in today news could be found in the period of barbaric migration too.
What conclusion did you mange to find about Europe, how do you think it would fall?
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Well, some europeans politicians (Sarkozy by eg, but I've heard that others one want that) want to create migrants centers at the borders of EU to avoid the Syrian migration into the center of EU. If these crazy guys succeed to their wish, Bulgaria & Romania would be submerged demographically (like the Dalmatians with Slavics migrations).
About Europe ? Well the current economical policy of Eurozone is adapted for Mitteleuropa, it couldn't work for Western (that's why Britain is better than France nowaday), nor for Southern Europe. And Germany will never accept another policy, so if Syriza come to power in Spain, of the FN in France (and sadly lepen could win in 2017, because our two mains parties share the same technocratic policy and are both hated by most of French), the Euro will probably be break.
Some people even start to ask for an alternative to the casual "Franco-German friendship", some suggest a Latin cooperation, I've even read last week a newspaper article suggesting to create a Franco-Italian state : www.marianne.net/agora-si-fran…
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I see, so you believe that the economical aspect would fail, but not political?
oh, I dream of a reunified neolatin culture, but that's destinated to stay an utopia, I guess
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Yes, we start to unify our money too quick, and too early, there is still too much
difference between europeans states, we can't have the same money.
However a political federation with more than one money is possible.
After all, it was casual in medieval & early modern era to have more than one
money inside a state.
But I tend also to think that the end of Euro will also stop the european unification.
We probably need to destroy the current technocracy to try later to create
a real european democracy :-/.
Who know, EU use to be an utopia, democracy too ^^
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Mmm, probably European integration process was too slow, if it was more quick integration could be more certain, whatever, I believe that in today world, something like having more than one currency in the same country would be a mess
between what difference are you talking about? because if you mean cultural one it will be quiet impossible to get over it
If a latin Union will ever be possible I don't think I will live enough to see it
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Well that's because Europeans try too early to create a political Europe (just after war : the "Communauté Européenne de Défense") that's why France refuse it, because we weren't yet reconciliate with Germany, and the idea to fight with Germans after being invaded with them didn't sound good at this time.
That's why Europeans try to create the political union thanks to economical union, step by step. It was slow, but even quicker it couldn't work totally. A political union is necessary to unify the economy, that's why we create this monstruous technocratic EU instead of a democratic one. ^^' ...
I was speaking about economical & social difference. By eg France, Britain or Northern Italy are less industrialized and have a better demography than Germany, but at the same time we've a better industrialization (and also better demography) than Greece, Spain or Southern Italy.
That's why a "Mitteleuropean Union" could work, or a Franco-Italian Union (even if Southern Italy would probably suffer, a Franco-Italian money would probably be too strong for them, except if we agree to have massive investment from France & Northern Italy to Southern Italy).
But Germany & Greece in a same monetary union, that couldn't work.
When the Eurozone will implode, I guess that Germany will try to create a new Markzone, that's why I tend to think our two countries will probably become closer, because if we didn't do that we will be marginalized. Perhaps Catalonia will join us if they seceede from Spain, and same with Wallonia (because their economy is close to Nord-Pas-de-Calais & Lorraine's economy, when the economy of Flander is closer to the Dutch & German's economy).
It's more a theory than a correct prediction of the future, but it's still a possible future
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Alright, I see, well, this prediction are possible but it needs a miracle for southern Italy, Italy tried in a lot of ways to get south out of poor economy, but never succeeded
I believe that if Belgium was split we'd all be happier, and economy would gain
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Loool how cute XD
Just wait for it, I can make a troll map too 
Ah I see you followed the discussion excluded Korsika and added channel islands+ french switzerland
and the dutch part along the Rhein.
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Ahah, i can't wait to see it
yes, these are french natural borders
btw i've added also part of german switzerland until river reuss because geographical criteria demands it
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Yep no problem
Someone who makes Großdeutschland maps must also tolerate Großfrance or Italy maps XD
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ah yeah, i see, well i agree, and so should who makes maps of greater nations with those who do großdeutscheland
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No corse but here is a very interesting map , it's pretty rare to see France own the Helvetian.
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Oh you mean Corsica in English (corse without capital C anymore seems more course 
Actually in this map France reaches far east, maybe even to much far away including many Germanic peoples
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Yes this territory is not part of Gaul it's more geographically (and culturally) italian, but Napoleon come from Corsica 
Not really, the natural border the part added in Switzerland can correspond at the Helvetii a Gallic tribe . www.forumancientcoins.com/anci…
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actually we don't have so important personalities coming from that island, but don't forget that Napoleon's mum family was 100% Italian, whatever i presume that Napoleon may be considered French, since he also changed its name from Buonaparte to Bonaparte to make it sound more french
oh yes, but like or not, they are now (more like it not according to me ^^) German
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It was emperor of french so i think we can consider it as French
Yes and
when it comes to draw borders countries are somewhat more generous, the provinces can also be Frenchified as Alsace, ethnicity has never really existed for France. but hey you can also give them an autonomous area within the country, otherwise the geographical France will be very small
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