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mayshing — Copy Ninja training guide by-nc-nd

Published: 2011-10-03 02:18:06 +0000 UTC; Views: 34756; Favourites: 1193; Downloads: 465
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Description CD's fun Artistic copy Ninja training guide. Based on my own experience in copying... (I might color a few if i feel like it)

My own style falls somewhere in level 40-50, in the normal anime range. My copy skill is pretty high at this point if i want to spend the time for it...


Don't ask me:

What Level is ________ (insert series) according to this chart?

What level am I? (my style, my work, my etc)


You can figure it out based on the chart, you are smart, you can't be too far off.

OK... ok, if you DO ask, I might answer if i feel like it. ;D
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Featured Qs:

"Why not copy photograph?"

- It's okay to copy photograph, but it's not the highest level of practice, it's also easier to make excuses for yourself for not achieving the best result with a photograph than another artwork. (Photographs are better as reference material for original work, not as good as studies samples for leveling up) But this explanation does not apply to all cases, I do use photographs, when they are really good they help. But copying another master's strokes to fix your own is not something you get from copying photos.


"How come some cartoon characters are on lower end of the scale they are much more complicated than that!"

A: READ the DISCLAIMER.

It's a lot faster to learn to "COPY" those characters based on shapes and proportion compare to "realism" or "anime and hero cartoons with anatomy" which you have to have additional anatomy knowledge to copy one really accurately.

Animation character designs ARE DESIGNED to be COPIED! They SHOULD BE EASIER to redraw and copy thus they are on lower end of the scale.

And don't lump drawing skill of copying with animation skill together. They are TWO SEPARATED SKILL SET that has core-relation to one another but you CAN have great animation without a great drawing. (Ex: Animation Vs animator)

That's why an animation with both "great animation" and "great drawing" like Beast in "Beauty and the Beast" is so precious.



"I disagree with your scale"
A: No one said you can't make your own~ You are welcome to make another and share with me which one is more difficult to you. It varies by different people.
Some who are used to realism will think Cartoon is mad hard, and those who are used to cartoon will think realism is mad hard.

I started in the middle, so I charted it based on the layers of knowledge required and time spent required for the difficulties and levels.



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How to use:
Use the chart to compare the level where you are at in terms of your own style, and your ability to copy other people's style.

+ When to move up: If you have been copying simpler style, and can do them well, move up.

+ When to move down: When you have trouble with more complex styles, try some really simple lower level ones, you might get a few lessons you have never learned before to apply to more complex styles!

+ note: There are some skills that doesn't come from copying, if you can copy very well but cant apply to your own work when you want to, you need to try other methods (like real life models, and still life.)

+You can skip level practicing, aim for the highest, that's the point of this guide. But if you have trouble with the highest level, doing lower ones help.

+the whole point of copying is to play detective with the artwork you are copying, you have to keep asking yourself and figure out "why is the person making a stroke here? Why is the person using the color there?" If you don't do that, copying is useless.

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Sharing: You are allowed to print this, to use this chart to show anyone who need to know where they are on practice level. As long as it's non-commercial.


+ Benefit of copying: It forces you to get rid of your usual habits and learn to adapt something new, and learn the observation skill of the artist at higher level than you.

People in the past has used copying to practice, it's not a crime.

It's an important skill to level up in!

Think of it this way, when you are at level 99, and you still draw manga/anime/cartoon, you can really tell people "This is my style and I choose to be this way!" because you can also do all other styles and prove them wrong!


If you DO copy, do not, DO NOT post it on Deviantart (unless its public domain artwork, like classical paintings.) because this is a GALLERY SITE, not a STUDY site. You can post them on photobucket or facebook, tumblr, blog, no one cares.
Related content
Comments: 272

OlegTsoy [2011-11-14 15:41:38 +0000 UTC]

Realy nice thing ) Thanks ) It's can be usefull.

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littleChaoticgirl [2011-11-14 13:25:52 +0000 UTC]

depending on my gallery can you tell me what level am i in ? if you can please

[link]

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mayshing In reply to littleChaoticgirl [2011-11-14 17:52:59 +0000 UTC]

45-49. And a bit lower because you haven't shown a perfect copy yet. Your coloring level is slightly higher but i don't have a chart for it yet. ^^bb If you get your linework cleaner, and pay more attention to shapes, you are ready to move up.

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littleChaoticgirl In reply to mayshing [2011-11-16 07:04:52 +0000 UTC]

oh 0o0 !

thank you very much foe the advise ^v^

can you do a coloring chart ? OvO that well be great XD

umm ! sure thing and thank you for responding >v<

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mayshing In reply to littleChaoticgirl [2011-11-16 18:33:54 +0000 UTC]

i'm surprised by your gratitude. That's nice to receive.
Coloring chart.... i will think about it...

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littleChaoticgirl In reply to mayshing [2011-11-17 16:33:02 +0000 UTC]

hahahahaa why is everyone who comment doesn't like their levels ? xD

GREAT ovo

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mayshing In reply to littleChaoticgirl [2011-11-18 18:35:05 +0000 UTC]

I am used to people either being upset at my comment and get quiet (not commenting back) or just say a simple "thanks" without really meaning it in their text when I do actual comparison of their work to commercial standards. I often feel like I am wasting my time doing them a favor so I have stopped doing it as often as before when I started

As for coloring chart, after thinking I believe is not reasonable to do a level chart with color, because of style issue. You can have really boring colors but if you executed the drawing well enough and the painting is done well enough, you can still have awesome results. Exciting color is just a style, there's no advancement in that, only preference.
I recommend this coloring tutorial to you: [link] and [link]

But what you need is just work on drawings, you have naturally good color sense.

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littleChaoticgirl In reply to mayshing [2011-11-22 14:07:22 +0000 UTC]

oh i see ... actually it's not cool when someone do you a favor to act *negative* and stuff so i know what you mean you a good person ^^ and i don't think you r wasting your time ~

true enough black and white are the most boring choices but how many master pieces with those two ? XD can't count hahaha ..

Thank you for the tuts ^()^ ~

oh thank you very much my dear i really appreciate it ;w;

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mayshing In reply to littleChaoticgirl [2011-11-22 20:41:07 +0000 UTC]

You're welcome. ^^

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Feldiarts In reply to ??? [2011-11-14 11:20:32 +0000 UTC]

Well, I don't really like your way of analyzing artstyles. I mean, look at the wonderful peace of animation named "Animator vs. Animation". In your leveltable it's between 2 and 9. But the way it's animated its for me a minimum level of 70 - 80. Some of your lvl 91 - 100 stuff isn't the taste of everyone. You can't compare two comnpleteley different styles because that's like comparing a pear and an apple.

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mayshing In reply to Feldiarts [2011-11-14 17:54:37 +0000 UTC]

drawing level yes, animator VS animation is 2-9.
But animation level, no,animator vs animation is much higher, you can't lump animation skill with drawing skills.
You can have minimum drawing skills and great animation skills,
and great drawing skills with limited animation skill.
It's two separated skill set.

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Feldiarts In reply to mayshing [2011-11-14 19:16:39 +0000 UTC]

You did the same with different Styles

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mayshing In reply to Feldiarts [2011-11-14 19:33:43 +0000 UTC]

??? Explain.

The guide is no science, it's a rough range layout to encourage people to move out of easier subjects and move to harder studies.

It's based on personal experience on what I know maybe harder or easier to copy. I know study hours can vary based on different people.
My copying is not perfect they are merely "similar result" in comparison to the original, 80% at best.

If you disagree with the guide you can make your own no one will stop you.

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lonlynemo [2011-11-14 04:43:09 +0000 UTC]

You have no Idea how complicated Micky Mouse and SpongeBob are, It is not that they have abstract proportions, ability to show exaggerated body language in emotion. Its also horrible to say its a good thing to compare style to show amount of experience and talent, it like saying "you must be this tall to get this much credibility".

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mayshing In reply to lonlynemo [2011-11-14 17:57:24 +0000 UTC]

again you are lumping animation skill with drawing skill.
It's one thing to copy a mickey mouse its another to make it move. A kid can copy Micky mouse, but only a skilled animator can give it life.

Micky mouse and spongebob are fairly complicated that's why they are on the middle of the chart. But no anatomy or complex memorization is required for their design on top of shape based designs people have to remember.
Thus they are on lower end of the overall "copying" scale. Read the disclaimer.

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lonlynemo In reply to mayshing [2011-11-14 18:56:08 +0000 UTC]

I was not talking about animation movement, I was talking about movement of still life.

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mayshing In reply to lonlynemo [2011-11-14 19:02:34 +0000 UTC]

for the general drawing movement? That's to be trained. True, the way I designed the chart is based on if there's additional knowledge required to achieve similar result. For example, Rabbit in Winnie the Pooh should be higher than Micky mouse because Micky mouse is more tube/shape based than Rabbit. To draw Rabbit, one actually has to study the skull of the rabbits slightly, Beast would be higher yet because of the anatomy required for Beast in order to capture more subtlety.
Micky Mouse can be tricky in it's own way but doesn't require a tight anatomy knowledge on top of the drawing knowledge in gesture and the overall relation of the proportion. As for the overall small differences between each drawing that depends on how precise one wants to be at copying.

Do you get how I am laying it out now on the chart?

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lonlynemo In reply to mayshing [2011-11-15 05:05:38 +0000 UTC]

It is a chart for people whom only wish to learn how to copy, not to create.

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mayshing In reply to lonlynemo [2011-11-15 17:54:13 +0000 UTC]

yep. Its important when they don't even know how to copy properly. Creation should be another tutorial.

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lonlynemo In reply to mayshing [2011-11-16 03:48:31 +0000 UTC]

hmmm, I guess, but I still feel that their is an aspect of movement that makes Sponge Bob and Mickey Mouse harder to copy than what you grade them as. As well, I was thinking in terms of this sort of idea: [link] .Sorry to bother you, and thank you for listening and commenting back.

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mayshing In reply to lonlynemo [2011-11-16 18:04:50 +0000 UTC]

yes, that's the professional level gesture drawing. For some who never practiced it, it will be hard to copy, but if you only copy their clean and inked version, it actually is slightly easier because inking in general are done by people with lower skill level. *sadly.*

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Drak-Arts [2011-11-14 03:18:43 +0000 UTC]

Soooo... might not be too pompous to claim I'm around Lv. 60-70... maybeh?

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ArtCrumbss [2011-11-14 03:05:31 +0000 UTC]

I agree with the way this is in terms of detail..

As an animator (in training) ... it's my job to copy things... I have to draw it the same way as everyone else. It is very difficult to copy and draw the same way SO MANY TIMES, but many different people. Animators, depending on the type can range anywhere on here.... just thought I'd through that out there.

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christy-person [2011-10-30 06:17:50 +0000 UTC]

I second the opinion of ~DisgraphicArtist . this is so simple but i really shows a lot. No lengthy explainations, and yet it's easy to follow.

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free4fireYouTube [2011-10-29 19:52:41 +0000 UTC]

sometimes I feel like these arent levels but years...also I think I`ve done it wrong and skipped a few levels damnit! XD

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DisgraphicArtist [2011-10-22 07:35:48 +0000 UTC]

This is one of the most useful things I've seen on here in a long time. It's both simplistic and very informative, allowing the artist to gauge their skill on a manageable scale and providing insight on what skills they should expect to have with each milestone. Well done.

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holavengoaflotar [2011-10-19 22:52:14 +0000 UTC]

im on lvl 1

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whiskeyii In reply to holavengoaflotar [2011-11-14 05:37:21 +0000 UTC]

Great! Nowhere else to go but up, right?

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BrandinLink [2011-10-08 17:44:07 +0000 UTC]

Informative.

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killadroid [2011-10-08 01:17:09 +0000 UTC]

Wow, so the master copy you did the other day must mean that your copying skill is in the 90's!

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guardianxofxmoon [2011-10-08 01:05:17 +0000 UTC]

this will come in handy. :3

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PeppermintMoriGirl In reply to ??? [2011-10-06 21:59:33 +0000 UTC]

Thank you for this. It's like a visual reminder for me to continue to strive to do my best.

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Satoru-Ikari In reply to ??? [2011-10-05 20:58:45 +0000 UTC]

Nice breakdown, I know some people who could benefit from this.

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CupcakesRFancyMufins In reply to ??? [2011-10-05 02:59:29 +0000 UTC]

lol, compare lvl 91-100 to lvl 2-9 XD

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kin444 In reply to ??? [2011-10-05 02:38:43 +0000 UTC]

I lol'd because a year ago I would have probably been offended ^^

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StarfireandSakura [2011-10-05 02:21:25 +0000 UTC]

Probably level 40...ish. Or less. :C Still, thanks for the chart! It's a good way to compare different styles.

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Arkiome [2011-10-05 01:14:54 +0000 UTC]

I think I'm around 40-60. :'D

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estella-gaffigan [2011-10-05 01:14:12 +0000 UTC]

I really like your guidelines for improvement. One question I do have, however, is this: What would be a good example of levels 41 to 49 that isn't anime (i.e., "American" cartoons)?

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seleina-scorpio [2011-10-05 00:56:46 +0000 UTC]

the one thing i dont like about this is it says that level 90-100 is a level all artist want to achieve, with isnt competly true, yes all artists strive to get better but not everyone wants their work to be a "master painting", some people (like me) are content sticking with comics, anime and semi-realism

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roxietran In reply to seleina-scorpio [2011-10-05 01:25:10 +0000 UTC]

You seem to be misinterpreting the purpose of the chart. The levels represent complexity in style, knowledge of anatomy and detail. It's your own choice to move up or down to learn different skills (recommended in reality to go in both directions).

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Gofelem In reply to roxietran [2011-10-22 00:52:36 +0000 UTC]

Everytime I draw anime, It feels like Icrave for lvl90-100.

It always made me think how accurate the anatomy,landscape is.

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seleina-scorpio In reply to roxietran [2011-10-05 02:16:22 +0000 UTC]

i know that i still cant help but feel like im being labeled by this chart, like "oh you draw this so your skill level is this" i guess that just my point of view

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InteriorSweet In reply to ??? [2011-10-05 00:03:13 +0000 UTC]

Oh yay! Someone who finally understands that in a way coping is a good things if it's not claimed as your own work. I've had art friends kinda give me the face when I show them my drawings that are reproduced the same way except maybe different characters or clothes or whatever. I see it as understanding better how to do things that you normally can't learn by reading an instruction book or something like that. Copying poses helps me become more loose since I'm usually stiff if I draw from my mind and learn it. I'm happy there's no one arguing that this is wrong~

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mayshing In reply to InteriorSweet [2011-10-05 00:23:33 +0000 UTC]

as long as u are giving credit where its due, copying is how we learn. Like we have to copy vocabulary before we can write a paragraph. It's the same with drawings.

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Saphiera12 In reply to ??? [2011-10-04 22:33:42 +0000 UTC]

I think I'm at 49-50.

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Vinea In reply to ??? [2011-10-04 22:25:47 +0000 UTC]

I think that this ladder is a bit naive. Accurate, expressive and clear characters are sometimes better and harder to draw than realistic drawings.
Thinking that realistic is good and stylized bad is too simple. To make a good comicky character, you needs basics in anatomy etc, if not more than basics.

I'm not being mean or anything, I think it's a great ladder... for copying. But rating a style with this ladder is kind of reductive, and not necessarily a good guide for beginners.

(Just what I think, feel free to argue if kindly and respectfully)

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mayshing In reply to Vinea [2011-10-05 00:00:55 +0000 UTC]

i agree with you on some level, some simpler characters have less "rules" to go by when copying and its actually more difficult. However, as the goal of this guide is to produce "similar" result not "exact" result, I would argue those simpler characters are indeed easier to draw to similar result to.

And frankly this is just a guide to get some kids to draw realism where they would other wise say "nah, anime/cartoon is good enough for me." I have seen someone who draws REALLY good powerpuff, or pokemon... but never move away from where they are. This guide's goal is to encourage that.

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kupocake In reply to Vinea [2011-10-04 22:44:26 +0000 UTC]

I totally agree. For the sake of copying, PERHAPS this ladder is applicable, but as someone who switches between 'toons and "semi-realism" very often, in addition to doing straight up "realism," it's very naive to say that one is easier than the other. Each stylization has different criteria: you wouldn't care about squash & stretch with a Renaissance painting, and you certainly wouldn't care about photorealistic rendering if you're drawing a shoujo kawaii character.

This tutorial is pretty misleading. I'm sure Mayshing's heart is in the right place, but for a lot of people (like me) who switch up styles very often, I find it rather insulting.

And that's not getting into the whole "cartoons are simple" debate. Cartoons are ridiculously difficult to draw well. It's only simple if you're just eyeballing and not understanding the structure beneath it.

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Starath [2011-10-04 21:45:37 +0000 UTC]

This is really neat. I never thought of art depictions like a continuum, although it totally makes sense now that I see it that way. My art ability can go up to 50 if I really try, but somehow I always maintain cartoony characteristics. I learn by copying styles before trying anything on my own... Someday I'll be consistent. Thanks for creating this learning tool!

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Nikira12 [2011-10-04 21:15:46 +0000 UTC]

I'm pretty sure I'm in the 40-45ish range with my regular style... Although I think I'm aiming too high with that assumption, IDK. =____=;

Great chart! Really a helpful idea, I really like it.

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