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hopebringer-jem In reply to ??? [2016-10-31 06:56:34 +0000 UTC]

Hate to point out that the first schism in the Christian faith was between the Roman Catholics and Eastern Orthodox churches as they were trying to layout a guide and doctrine to keep conflicting and misleading texts and beliefs from tearing the church apart. That hasn't worked out so well.... So, they are different than current Christian churches but they were the accumulation and support line for communication in some of the early days.

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Wolfpackersson09 In reply to hopebringer-jem [2016-10-31 12:44:58 +0000 UTC]

I actually don't mind you pointing that out. Not saying that it didn't happen, but will say that legalism in Christianity are not good bedfellows, as Legalism, seen in many religions(Bhuddism, Islamic, Hinduism as examples) will make it either impossible to achieve any sense of salvation, keep people from salvation save for a select group, or breed the 'holier than though' mentality. I'm a Christian, but I know I'm not better then everyone else.

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hopebringer-jem In reply to Wolfpackersson09 [2016-10-31 22:07:26 +0000 UTC]

That's honestly the majority of most people in any faith, even the loosest of organized religious groups and organizations. There are always some who go holier than thou even in an a barely organized group. We can all agree that secular politics should never be controlled by religious institutions and vice versa. There are many examples of this in history and across the world. The level of organization is not what causes the problems, it is the unwillingness to work together of individuals within any belief. Religion isn't the same as faith. They can go together well or work seperately. Like others have said, even a small change in your own willingness to be open can spark others to the same. There is a large number of matching core values in many beliefs, if you ate willing to find them. It's what I've been trying to do. Yes, I feel knowing how unbiased and biased history from all cultures that doesn't mean I'm right. Just where I'm starting from.

I would love to know where you are starting from so we can discuss this further if you want.

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Wolfpackersson09 In reply to hopebringer-jem [2016-10-31 23:24:58 +0000 UTC]

I'd agree that people would get along more if they don't shove a stick of truth up their fractured butthole. I actually enjoy studying the mythos of different religions, if only because I'm interested in mythology. I'm going to take the time now to say that I don't know everything, since I am only a human being, still imperfect. We could discuss this more, but I'm not sure if it would turn into an argument or a genuine discussion of faith and matters of spiritual health. In fact, I'm not disagreeing that History is written by the victors, and thus would be biased or unbiased to certain things. Trust me in that people love to shoot the messenger when they don't like the message.

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hopebringer-jem In reply to Wolfpackersson09 [2016-11-01 02:07:13 +0000 UTC]

As long as no one goes all "my way is right and everyone else is going to hell" I don't mind a good discussion on strange things. There is no real way to figure out where another person is coming from if you don't ask them about it. It's just sad that doing that now brings out fangs when the intent is just to learn where we agree and agree to disagree. I have heard one of the most difficult people in my life often say they would rather be correct than right. Yes, they are hard to deal with at times but I find the sentiment and intention behind it refreshing at least.

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Wolfpackersson09 In reply to hopebringer-jem [2016-11-01 03:02:44 +0000 UTC]

Unfortunately, when it comes to spirituality, it's hard not to get into the situation of 'this way is the right way'. Hell is technically a choice, and the duty of a Christian is to inform people that the choice is there. Some Christians are possibly not even Christians because of that 'I want to be correct on everything then righteous'. Every form of faith says this is the way, but I go with logic and comparison in terms of what the religions do and so on. I was raised in a Christian household, but my parents can't get me to choose Heaven if I don't want to. I could tell you what I have perceived in terms of the varying religions, as sometimes it is good to know the religions of others or the interests of others to help connect with them. Christians are told to interact with the world, like being a traveler making his way home, but to not act in the same way. We shouldn't be arrogant or holier then though, we shouldn't hate because of skin color and stuff like that. God looks at the soul, so why should we judge by the flesh? Even James the half-brother of Jesus said we shouldn't place burdens on others that we can't handle. While it is true that any case of religion and spirituality will possibly have a 'this is the right way or only way', part of the problem is how it is presented. Easy to get people turned off if you talk about religion. I can't change how you think or believe. I could persuade, encourage, argue, urge, and even beg, but the end choice is between you and God. I'm also not going to judge you either way. Otherwise, I could easily list the logical reasons to believe the Bible, besides the historical evidence that still exists and has been found.

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paradigm-shifting In reply to ??? [2016-08-17 18:24:45 +0000 UTC]

Good. It seems you've got my point pretty much entirely. The larger group always gets blamed for a small group of idiots, regardless of which religion (or even non-religious group) one might refer to. This is typically because the silent majority never speaks up to say "hey! these fools don't represent us!" because most people / humans are afraid of "making waves". They don't wanna stick their necks out and risk harassment for it. While not realizing it is because the majority that won't speak up, that the harassment comes.

Yep, I think we're pretty much on the same page with that. If more people like you, said more things like this -- then Christians wouldn't get such a bad rap. Just like if more Muslims stood up and railed against terrorist ideologies, then Muslims wouldn't get such a bad rap. Silence is consent. Its part of why I speak up about things. Not to try to convince anyone of anything, but because I understand that silence is consent, by default. And I don't consent to ass clowns representing me on anything.

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paradigm-shifting In reply to Vandaalis [2015-12-01 03:15:12 +0000 UTC]

I've known many, but I'll show you one.

Here she is: 

Go converse with her. She'll talk. She's an incredibly sweet girl. She's Muslim. She's not a hateful wack job. She doesn't want to go murder anyone (Christians or otherwise). And she just wants to enjoy life and live in peace. And she'll tell you that most Muslims are like her, the extremists are a minority and that main stream spin is simply a powerful tool of the establishment.

Her only fear is that people like you refuse to beleive people like her exist, and that people like you might do harm to people like her as a result of that sort of extremist thinking.

Extremist doesn't require religion. Extreme thinking is simply that. Extreme. Absolute. Neurotic. Most people who live in society today are extremists by pure default of society collapsing into a state similar to what lead to the destruction of the Roman Empire.

Anyways, you two both have a good talk. You'll like her, if you're open to your own beliefs being contradicted.

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Vandaalis In reply to paradigm-shifting [2015-12-01 21:50:04 +0000 UTC]

Oh what shameful propaganda man, so pathetic, you just accused me of possibly harming someone. Do you see yourself how rightfully up your own hole you are? I have never hurt a woman in my life, regardless of her behaviour, color and what not. 
Might do harm, wow that is so despicable to think of others like this. And after saying such nonsense you invite me to talk, even more miserable. 
What about me indicates to you that I might do harm to her or anyone? Is it cause I am vocal, have strong and accurate understanding of lies and insanity? Because I curse? what is it? m? How come I havnt attacked any muslims that walk past me on the street on daily basis? 
What do you know about empires? Look at 8 stages of an empire, we are in stage 7 Decadence. In this stage populism is the beginning of the end and one of major lies trough these stages is any form of organized religion. You are simply lacking information to understand the problem as a whole and you lack all he entities that are involved. There are simple reasons why this muslim propaganda is allowed and if we look who sponsors the whole gig, it becomes very clear what their intentions are. But you hide behind labelling me as an aggressor, where in reality you are exactly that. 
I am non religious and dont use such broken ways as beliefs, simple statistics will do me. Also there is no proof or actual relation between religion of any form and ethics in people. Religion simply does not provide any morals to anyone. Ask her 1 question - can she go out her house without a burka or what not? Or go to a party dressed hot showing leg and cleavage, much like any modern western woman can do if she so desire. And if the answer is NO, or the excuse is - I would never want that, then dont bother covering up this with more lies. islam is like heroin, there is nothing good about it and it will soon mess your life up. Do I beat up every smackhead because they are weak and do drugs, of course not, only a nutjob like you imagines harm where there is none. I see them as broken sad people who are lost, not my fault nor responsibility. Do I hate them, nope, you can have all the hate and fear, I dont use those, I do my best to understand and so far there is a massive pile of evidence how harmful religion is and very little or virtually none to prove the opposite. I dont care how you feel about  it, because I dont, for every 1 fake argument there ar 10 true ones that defy it. Also is it not bad for a muslim woman to speak with a man?

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paradigm-shifting In reply to Vandaalis [2015-12-02 00:46:33 +0000 UTC]

Well, my apologies. You were just talking the way I am used to people talking when they "want all Muslims to die, men women children and all". I guess I am just so used to people who say the things you are saying, always tell me that they think they should "kill em' all and let God sort them out". My apologies if you were NOT going there. This would be the FIRST time that someone has talked the way you talk about Muslims, that didn't have an "they all need to die, every last one of those sand niggers" type of attitude about it. So my apologies if I jumped the gun.

But, at least I'm not the only one of us who made an assumption.

"Ask her 1 question - can she go out her house without a burka or what not? Or go to a party dressed hot showing leg and cleavage, much like any modern western woman can do if she so desire. And if the answer is NO, or the excuse is - I would never want that, then dont bother covering up this with more lies. islam is like heroin, there is nothing good about it and it will soon mess your life up."

She can tell you this herself, but you're dead wrong.

She CAN go out of her house without a burka.
She CAN goto a party dressed hot showing leg and cleavage.
She DOES think traditional archaic old Muslim thinking is STUPID and she doesn't subscribe to it.

So you see, I am used to people who think they know it all about everyone already. Am I going to sound self righteous and arrogant to those sorts of people? Of course. Classic psychological projection. If I don't talk bad about all Muslims, it must mean I have some "Muslim Adenga". lol. Thats paranoid. I don't want to stereotype and hate on everyone, so it must mean i'm conducting a psyop. Alright, cool.

I respect your right to think and feel as you do.

You're not going to talk to her because you're not interested in knowing whats true, you're interested in maintaining your existing world view paradigm. And that is inherent in how defensive you just got towards me about it. Your "how dare you" attitude, instead of civilly correcting the errors in my presumption. You act exactly like the social justice warriors I always make fun of and have absolutely no remorse about making fun of.

I also do not consider you as being rude or wrong or whatever, for saying anything you just said to me. You are being HONEST with me about how you truly feel. That I fully respect. So I respect you with the same level of honesty and I will not condemn you for yours. Condemn me all you wish, if you wish. I don't take issue with it. That is your right to think, feel, believe and express as you please to.

So if you're going to go on a rant trying to "tell LuckyPsych who she supposedly is", instead of ASKING her who she is and how she conducts her life -- then I don't really think you're open to talking. You're only open to LECTURING people on who you assume they are. You do not seem interested in getting to actually know who people are. You seem to be just one of those types sitting here on the internet just waiting for something to get offended by. Well congrats, you've found it here. You'll find more in my journals, art and videos. I don't pull any punches. So if you're looking for views to be offended by, you'll find lots here. You've come to the right place.

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paradigm-shifting In reply to Danubium [2015-11-17 23:45:48 +0000 UTC]

You're entitled to your opinion, but thats a logical fallacy.

Saying that all Muslims are bad is like saying all black people are bad. And there are some folks who think that, too. Whatever nationality or ethnicity YOU happen to be, theres a similar case made against YOU already. And by "you" I mean everyone, anyone. Prejudice is what it is.

Are there nasty people? Yes. Are there terrorists? Yes. Should those people be dealt with? Of course. Blow em all to fucking hell. But does that mean 100% of a particular race or religion is 100% evil? No, thats Hitler talk.

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Danubium In reply to paradigm-shifting [2015-11-18 13:42:49 +0000 UTC]

But does that mean 100% of a particular race or religion is 100% evil? No, thats Hitler talk.

#NotAllScientologists

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paradigm-shifting In reply to Hermy-one [2015-11-17 09:29:55 +0000 UTC]

I agree. Most Christians don't want to go around killing non-Christians. Of course there is that small number of extremists who do want to. Some of the have. Most of those type don't have to means, otherwise they would. I think there are hateful idiots in every group and every nation and every race, but they are a minority of trouble makers. Granted, give that minority the ability to be violent and they surely shall be. Especially if they are surrounded by a DISARMED population. ISIS tried to pull some bullshit in Texas and it did not go well. Just gave the Texans something to hunt other than deer, and they bagged as many ISIS members as they did deer, thats for sure. If the people of Paris had been armed, you wouldn't have had all of those fatalities. You'd have had some very dead terrorists. If that college in Oregon wasn't one of those lame ass gun free zones, you'd have seen one dead terrorist instead of a bunch of dead students.

Terrorists are cowards. If you put them in a population capable of defending itself, they will NOT strike. Unless they are the suicidal type but even then, their reign of terror wouldn't get very far before they would be taken out.

The Bible and the Koran say the same barbaric things. They both also say some really good things, too. Funny how everyone likes to pretend the good stuff isn't in there and act as if only the bad stuff has any relevance. Its a totally one sided view. People could just as stupidly make claim that both the Koran and the Bible have nothing but good in them and how the people who follow both are next of kin to sainthood, if only the good were focused on and the negative stuff was all completely ignored. Both views would be absolutely skewed, of course. Neither view would be correct. Both views would be neurotic delusions. Though if you were going to have a neurotic delusion, one in which the dominant belief is to treat your neighbours with respect, is sure as hell a better delusion than the one that says kill everyone.

People who like hating others can't ever be swayed by pesky inconvenient things such as facts or evidence, as you stated. I always like to say, that the facts of any matter are completely irrelevant. This is because humans act based on their beleif systems and all actions have very real serious consequences. So even if a belief system is pure bunk, an action taken based on it is very real and thus will have very real consequences.

I have a very simple solution to end hate and racism and its so simple and practical that it would NEVER HAPPEN, because we don't live in a practical world. We live in a pathological world.

The solution is this:  take all of the hateful people of every nation, race, religion, etc and put them all on one big island. Put a HUGE stockpile of weapons at the center of the island and let the problem take care of itself.

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Danubium In reply to paradigm-shifting [2015-11-17 11:20:09 +0000 UTC]

Most Christians don't want to go around killing non-Christians. Of course there is that small number of extremists who do want to. Some of the have. Most of those type don't have to means, otherwise they would.

This is bullshit, sorry.

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paradigm-shifting In reply to Danubium [2015-11-18 02:05:18 +0000 UTC]

Actually, you're right. Most Christians do want to go around killing Non-Christians. They just have George W Bush be the spokes person instead of the Pope, and they contract out THE MILITARY to go on that Crusade, instead of doing it themselves. I stand corrected. Thank you.

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paradigm-shifting In reply to K-Zlovetch [2015-11-17 09:34:39 +0000 UTC]

Indeed! But extremists don't consider themselves as extremists. They consider themselves as right, logical, factual and rational; and they consider anyone ELSE who disagrees with them, as being extremists.

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K-Zlovetch In reply to paradigm-shifting [2015-11-18 20:28:07 +0000 UTC]

Yep, so true...

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paradigm-shifting In reply to K-Zlovetch [2015-11-19 11:53:39 +0000 UTC]

I just think the human race is going through puberty right now, metaphorically speaking. We've been such an ignorant and immature race, and now within the age of information we've kind of been forced to "face everything". This creates a lot of butt hurt, just as a teenager in transit of becoming an adult has a lot of "piss and vinegar" and "teen angst". I wise teenager directs that angst towards productive things, and an unwise one risks fucking up their entire life and utterly destroying themselves in the most literal aspects of that idea. So on the more mild end of the butt hurt, we see people on social media doing a lot of dick wagging. On the more extreme end, we see scandals, corrupt politics and terrorists. The silent majority now has a choice:  start speaking up, or be fucked. Obviously I've made my choice

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paradigm-shifting In reply to m193 [2015-11-17 09:45:39 +0000 UTC]

The only REAL difference between the violent Christian Extremists and the violent Muslim Extremists, are that the Christians are NOT being FUNDED and the Muslims ARE. If the violent Christian Extremists were FUNDED then indeed, they would be as violent. I guarantee it. It really dumbfounds me that most people forget the first rule of journalism:  FOLLOW THE MONEY.

But regardless of who and who isn't being funded, it doesn't change the fact that MOST PEOPLE within ANY GROUP are just regular people who just want to live their lives in peace.

I could make a compelling case against every race, every religion and every group. But what would be the point? I would be doing so knowing that its propaganda and spin. Because in every instance, I could find no shortage of people from every group committing atrocities. And in every instance, those people would be the extreme minority of the total populations of those groups.

You know, not too horribly long ago -- the same sorts of cases being made against Muslims have been made against black people. Not too long ago in the semi-rescent past, it was thought to be normal, logical and practical to view black people as violent animals that need to be exterminated. Some people actually still do make that case against them. And theres no shortage of rapes and murders committed by black people to clearly make that case. But again, its the MINORITY.

In the real world -- no group is "innocent". No group is "the good guys". Every group has skeletons in their closets and blood on their hands. So we can keep the hate going until we just all wipe each other out one day -- or -- we can grow the fuck up and act like adults. That doesn't mean we don't kill the people who are killing us. But it does mean we do so on a case-by-case basis instead of trying to incite race / religious warfare or genocide.

All human stupidity in all groups are equal. The main stream news just makes money hyping shit up. Anyone who thinks the main stream news is fair and balanced and shows us the whole truth about everything, needs to buy some ocean front property in Iowa from me, cuz I totally got some to sell to them.

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m193 In reply to paradigm-shifting [2015-11-17 17:45:07 +0000 UTC]

Can't disagree with you too much. But since the killing is happening NOW, we need to deal with the fact as they are NOW.
Your point about money is well taken. But note; violent Islamic groups ARE being funded, and violent Christian groups are NOT being funded. Consider the mind-set that leads to this.
Wealthy Islamic sources are giving money to Islamic terrorist groups. Wealthy Christian sources (for the most part) are NOT giving money to Christian terrorist groups.
This is a fundamental mind-set difference between current Christian and current Muslim societies.

One can reach back for causes, and causes are important to understand, but one has to deal with the event as they are now. "Blood on the hands" hundreds of years ago does not equal actual blood on the actual hands of terrorists right now. No "Western" or "Christian" group in current existence is currently launching attacks with the EXPLICIT INTENT of killing as many unarmed non-combatants as possible. Many Islamic terrorists groups are seeking that exact thing, right now.

My point here is that the equivalence between Christian fundamentalists and Muslim fundamentalists is false. This is not because there is something fundamentally more savory about Christian extremists as opposed to Muslim extremists.
It is because, right now, Muslim extremists are undertaking constant and brutal acts of violence, whereas Christian extremists are not.

And there is a corollary to this; as a proportion of the self-described Christian population, violent extremists are a very small proportion, and are not held in high esteem by a substantial number of other Christians. On the other hand, violent Muslim extremists are a substantial minority of the overall Muslim population, and even more telling, an even larger proportion of Muslims who are not personally willing to be violent none-the-less explicitly endorse and support the acts of the violent Muslim extremists.

So I have to disagree with one utterly on point you make. One does not need a side to be "perfect" or "innocent" to be the "good guys." Nor do the "bad guys" have to be devoid of any just causes or real grievances. When one side is, in a given time and place, morally better than the other side, that defines "good guys" and "bad guys." And right now, based on current actions, there are indeed "good guys" and "bad guys." The violent Muslim extremists (AND their supporters, both in terms of money and in terms of moral support) are the bad guys. Those who seek to stop them are the good guys.

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paradigm-shifting In reply to m193 [2015-11-18 01:48:07 +0000 UTC]

I understand your points and I see where your logic is going and why you have the logic you have. But in my view, you have not followed the money back far enough. The picture is bigger than that. From my perspective (and this is an analogy) its like you're saying "the lake is the biggest thing their is" and then I say "but what about the ocean?" and you're looking at me with your head tilted as if I'm smoking something I shouldn't be. lol

So I respect your right to your perspectives, but I can't ignore years of my own research, just because text on the screen from someone I don't know disagrees with me.

I also wouldn't expect you to take my text seriously either, as my text is on your screen and I am someone you don't know.

Most people just don't dig deeper because its uncomfortable to do so. I can't blame them for that. Because if you dig deeper, you'll find a whole lot of nasty details that are extremely unpleasant. No one "wants" that stuff to be true. No one wants to hear it. Its really disturbing stuff. So I can't really blame anyone for saying "nope, where i am is the limit, my logic is sound and you're just crazy". Can't blame them at all. Just like I can't blame someone for not wanting to walk through a pit of rattle snakes.

Beyond that I will note, that your points also have nothing to do with my deviation or the point my deviation is trying to make. The idea that "because Muslim terrorists exists, it means ALL Muslims are terrorists" is one of the most dangerous and destructive logical fallacies anyone could make. And you can replace "Muslim" with "black people" or any group you want to put in there. This sort of sentiment is historic and has a long term proven reputation for being destructive for all involved.

Its easy to do evil in the name of the greater good. But doing good in the name of the greater good, would actually be more logical. But we don't live in a logical world and if this pathological crazy world ever called me "sane", that is when I'd begin to worry.

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m193 In reply to paradigm-shifting [2015-11-18 02:27:45 +0000 UTC]

What do you find when you "follow the money back far enough"?

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paradigm-shifting In reply to m193 [2015-11-18 14:22:42 +0000 UTC]

I find that I get called a "conspiracy theorist" when someone who doesn't actually want to know, asks that question.

When you really do the research you find that yes, its true. About 10 or so corporations literally run the world and puppet all governments. And that these 10 corporations are run by a bunch of competing blood line families totalling in about several thousand people or so and so yes, lots of in breeding going on there. The money trail is easy to follow back to that, its just that most people aren't quite ready to accept it because they really don't know about psychology or neurology. How the brain works. How easy it is to trick and control people. They don't know much about the psychological tactics Hitler used. The list goes on. Its all disturbing information so understandably, a persons instant reaction is to scream like Luke Skywalker "no, thats not true! thats impossible!".

Though I don't deem myself a conspiracy theorist and I consider most of those who do deem themselves as conspiracy theorists tend to go down logical fallacy rabbit holes and end up bickering and bitching with each other, which really doesn't help anyone.

Theres no dark room filled with men in dark suits plotting to control the world. Theres just the people who run the mega corporations who already do control the world -- no planning or plotting required.

When you realize that rich criminals do criminal things with their money and that these sorts of people are psychopaths and really begin to research about psychopathic behaviour -- then suddenly, its not some crazy leap of logic anymore. How these people operate makes perfect sense.

And the masses are easily manipulated. They always have been. Adulthood has become a state of extended adolescence. If you present yourself as if you are an authority figure with power, you don't actually need to be one. People will just give you their power if you can wield a good scam and be charming and tell people exactly what they want to hear.

Thats how Hitler came to power. In our arrogance, we assume "well that can't happen again!" and especially for Americans. We all so arrogantly think "it can't happen here" but it is happening here and how many of us see it? Tell people the same tricks are being played on us again, and suddenly -- you're a conspiracy theorist. Thats just mud slinging speak for "you're telling me something that might creep me out, especially if it might be true, so shut up! you're disturbing my peace of mind!".

Organized crime controls all of the governments of the world and the people have been scammed. Its actually very easy to scam people. Especially when you have control over the educational system and the main stream media. People just automatically believe that if you have a certain title and status, you're telling the truth and are incapable of deception. And that if you don't have a certain title and status, then you're just a nutter. lol

There are so many things that are common place NOW that back in the 1980s and 1990s, if you told anyone that society was going to turn into what its become -- you'd have been instantly branded a conspiracy nut. People would have said "theres no way the American population would ever fall for that" or "there is no way people would consent to that" or "if they tried to pull something like that, there would be riots in the streets! people won't stand for it!". Because we were under the delusion of "this is the land of the free and the home of the brave, so what could possibly ever go wrong? this country loves freedom to much, they would NEVER abandon it! they would fight for it!".

Now these days things that used to be BASIC COMMON SENSE back in the 1980s and 1990s seem completely crazy to many people today, and the things that seemed like completely insane impossibilities in the 1980s and 1990s are accepted as being perfectly normal today.

So yes, its easy to manipulate peoples perceptions. To directly quote Hitler:

"The beautiful thing about the totalitarian state, is that those who fear it will emulate it"
"Using mass media deception, you can twist the perceptions of the masses so that they will view heaven as hell, and hell as heaven"

Thankfully people are waking up, and being able to communicate on the Internet does help speed up the process, but the Internet is not the cause of the process. The cause is rather an unfortunate thing, honestly.

Only when people have a personal experience in which they have in some way, shape or form ended up harmed or screwed in some way (or have had close friends and family harmed or screwed in some way) by the systems they used to trust that now have betrayed them, are they willing to open their minds to new data that is outside their existing box of paradigms. Until then -- no amount of documentaries, evidence or telling anyone anything -- no amount of logic or reason is of any use, when it comes to attempting to wake people up. With those things, you can only preach to the choir because the choir already "gets it". Otherwise, until desperation breeds genius and a person gets screwed over -- its all just going to sound like crazy talk.

This is why in an ironic way, I am thankful that the criminal elements who have run this planet for many years now, are starting to get so scared and desperate as a result of this awakening -- that they are just screwing more and more people over every day, in worse and worse ways. Because, its the only way people will wake up to anything. Otherwise, most people have not been taught how to think critically. They've been taught to believe what they've been raised to believe and auto-reject everything else as garbage.

I'm in my awakening process because I've learned my lessons the hard way, not because some book or documentary "said stuff". Because until a person is already in their process -- all the books and documentaries in the world are completely and utterly useless. Thats why I never try to convince anyone of anything and I respect peoples right to believe whatever it is they want to believe. Because their turn to get screwed is coming. I've had so many people come back to me apologizing for treating me harshly, because their time to get screwed came. And then their eyes opened. Without open eyes, its hard to do objective research. I even consider many of the people who follow the conspiracy theorists to still be "asleep". Those people have only opened their eyes to the idea that "something is wrong" but they've still not learned how to discern between following the money, and exaggerated hyped stories. They're still operating in the same "mode" as the people who don't know something is wrong and who still think the system is designed in their best interests. The system isn't broken, it works perfectly. We've just been lied to about what its there to actually do, so understandably people will think its "broken" if they don't know what its in place to do in the first place. Its there to keep people dumb as bricks, stressed out and controlled. To make sure people remain as little children so that they do not realize that they actually have rights. People think they have benefits and entitlements. People have no clue what a "right" even is.

So yeah, all of the finer point details about how the world works that you may or may not want to know or may or may not be as of yet willing to know, requires more time and research than anything I could possibly say in this forum. I can't give anyone a magic paragraph that clearly explains life, the Universe and everything. People are either willing to take the time to research on their own, or -- they're not ready for that yet. And if they're not ready, theres nothing I can do about it.

I hope that helps, but I won't hold it against you if it seems crazy. I just can't ignore my own life experiences and my own research into things simply because text on a screen from someone I don't know, says that I should. And yes, theres been many texts from people on my screen who have insisted that I should ignore my own experiences, and just take their word for things. lol.

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m193 In reply to paradigm-shifting [2015-11-18 17:07:16 +0000 UTC]

Well, I won't throw insulting names around, but to put it very mildly, I disagree with your assessment.

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paradigm-shifting In reply to m193 [2015-11-19 11:48:05 +0000 UTC]

Thank you for being civil and agreeing to disagree. Would be nice if more people learned that skill.

But I would like to encourage you to consider one simple point:  everything we deem as logical and obvious today, seemed crazy and extreme in times past. Humans are still fairly closed minded and still addicted to defending their existing paradigms. I think we have more of a "flat Earth mentality" now than we ever did when most people on Earth actually thought it was flat. Because now, we have all of our technological achievements to point at and tell ourselves the lie that we've supposedly moved out of primitive immature unenlightened attitudes. All thats done is created a human race that despite its modern marvels, has the most primitive immature unenlightened attitude that has ever existed to the best of our knowledge. One might call it a "Rome Complex". The Roman Empire fell because of this sort of thinking, and we've got that sort of thinking in much greater abundance than Rome ever did.

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m193 In reply to paradigm-shifting [2015-11-20 03:11:33 +0000 UTC]

Being a historian, I've never believed that people have become more advanced in their thinking than in ancient times. Our technology advances. We remain the same.

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FluffyLover1986 In reply to m193 [2015-11-17 05:05:33 +0000 UTC]

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paradigm-shifting In reply to yukamilee [2015-11-17 09:48:37 +0000 UTC]

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yukamilee In reply to paradigm-shifting [2015-11-18 06:59:55 +0000 UTC]

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paradigm-shifting In reply to timyvonstabs [2015-11-17 09:53:06 +0000 UTC]

Agreed. I think another problem is that the loud mouthed and hateful minority are quicker to speak up, where as the silent majority tends to remain mostly silent. I'm glad to see that so far its about 60/40 on this thread so far, with the silent majority being a little more vocal than usual. Of course though the hateful loud mouths are fun to discuss things with until the conversation gets so convoluted that it no longer serves a point -- its good to see that a lot of people seem to have more common sense than I would have thought they had even a year ago. So despite all of the "kill em all, let God sort em' out" morons -- I'm still seeing a pretty good number of regular people speaking up about how extremism in any form is stupid.

I don't think anyone here is saying "don't kill the terrorists". Yes, PLEASE. Kill the terrorists! Its just stupid to think that EVERYONE within a stereotyped group, is a terrorist.

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paradigm-shifting In reply to AnonymousRabbitLover [2015-11-17 09:53:21 +0000 UTC]

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AnonymousRabbitLover In reply to paradigm-shifting [2015-11-17 14:30:05 +0000 UTC]

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paradigm-shifting In reply to FluffyLover1986 [2015-11-17 10:04:29 +0000 UTC]

Why did McCain suggest that the USA "arm ISIS"? This was before "ISIS was a thing" when he said this. I can show you the video if you wish. WHY did he suggest we give arms to our enemy? Why would he do that? I just want to know your opinion because it always seems to be that Wall Street is always the ones "arming the terrorists" and without their monetary backing, those terrorists wouldn't be able to do anything.

Why did the USA give Osama Bin Laden money, training and arms in the 1980s as we called him a friend, while fully knowing he was crazy and then OOPS suddenly 9-11 happens not too long after? Why did McCain want to arm ISIS? Also, we DID end up arming ISIS. Why did we do that? Why did Eric Holder give guns to Mexican Drug Cartels? Why has America actually funded every extremist Islamic group that has ever been a pain in our ass and why did we continue to fund all of them even while we were claiming they were our enemies? Its all on public record. Admitted to in public by all involved in various records that are publicaly available. Why are ONLY the groups WE HAVE FUNDED become SUCH A PROBLEM? Where are all the "other Muslims"? Why are there not and why has there never been ANY of these groups that aren't operating on the tax payers dollar?

Of course, I'm not going to do your homework for you. You can look into this stuff, or not. Thats up to you. But why do we keep funding the enemy? Isn't that treason? And without that funding, how would they attack us? Throw camel turds at us? lol

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FluffyLover1986 In reply to paradigm-shifting [2015-11-17 23:48:41 +0000 UTC]

Never agreed with McCain on that one. He actually suggested that? He must be getting senile. Interesting that the U.S. funded such people. Bin Laden was a proxy war with Russia. The rest, I have no fkn clue.

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paradigm-shifting In reply to FluffyLover1986 [2015-11-18 00:22:17 +0000 UTC]

Unfortunately, people always read and blindly believe the headlines and rarely if ever do any real research. I mean, I don't blame people for it or hate them for it. For one, we do not live in a society that raises us to know any better and expecting someone to know what they don't know, would be like saying to a teenager "you have to pass this test and it will determine your final grade, but you're not allowed to study for it and if you fail then fuck you its your fault and you're a horrible person". People who hate those who speak in ignorance, are just as ignorant, because they are expecting people to know better who simply just do not.

Besides being DISCOURAGED from doing real research and being ENCOURAGED to be hateful and apathetic and defending whatever paradigms they have been caught up in without question (even as simple and stupid as a Harry Potter vs Twilight debate), people are not really given the time to think critically, much less any encouragement.

We goto school for most of the year when we are kids and teens. School is stressful. Summer break comes and we just wanna forget the world exits for 3 months to give ourselves a damn break. Then we enter the work force. Most people who are able to find work, they work 9 to 5 as someone else's slave at a stressful job. When they come home they just want to unwind so they don't go crazy, then goto sleep, then repeat again the next day. On top of that, we're bombarded by 24 / 7 fear porn bullshit in the media, because thats what gets ratings and makes money. We're going the way of Rome as a nation, if you understand the reference.

We've become as smug and apathetic and fucking stupid as the Ancient Romans. High on the fumes of our false sense of superiority.

On a note that is a bit of a mix of positive and negative -- the more I really learn about how things work and connect the dots and put things together -- as I learn about things such as physics, quantum physics, metaphysics, psychology, biology, neurology, geopolitics and just the whole gammet of the human experience and I pay attention to how all of these things are in symbiosis with each other and are in a configuration like ingredients within a cake -- it actually gives me a great sense of relief. Because I can see the climax things are coming to and quite frankly I welcome it. I see how paradigms effect the immune system. I see how hateful people are very likely to do THEMSELVES in making things like revenge holey unnecessary. I can see that God, the Universe, Nature or whatever euphemism anyone wants to call it -- really does have it covered. That when stupidity climaxes, those people win Darwin Awards. I don't have to hate them, they will destroy themselves. All I have to do, is be the best person I can be and SURVIVE THE STORM. Its always darkest before the dawn, but the sun will come back out.

As for McCain, heres the video:  www.facebook.com/paradigmshift…

I can't fault people for this, but they live in a delusional fairy tale. A fairy tale in which they think words on paper create magical force shields that prevent criminals from being criminals. A Disney-like paradigm in which governments can do no wrong, all politicians are saints and that those who run their country are on the side of the people, on the side of good, in defence against evil. Its the same delusion that the Nazis were under, that Rome was under and that every empire that has ever fallen has become entranced with.

The real truth is one that no one wants to face.

Theres about 5 or 10 big bullies. We call them "the biggest corporations that exist". They are run by several thousand people. Lets call these people, PSYCHOPATHS. Family bloodlines that date back even before Rome. Families that have repeated cycles of abuse, like how the son or daughter of an alcoholic is very likely to become an alcoholic themselves. So these families, they breed with each other. Incest is the best when you put your cousin to the test, apparently. As their family trees become more like a family bush, genetics corrupt and these families become more aggressive and stupid. Just like how goat farmers avoid inbreeding because the goats get too violent.

So these 5 or 10 or so big bullies, they boss around all of the smaller time bullies. We'll call these smaller time bullies "all the rest of the other corporations". Most people who are employed by any of these bullies, have no clue as to whats going on. They aren't in on any secret agendas. Theres no dark smokey room with guys around a table smoking cigars plotting the downfall of the world. Theres just psychopaths who are the minority, who have tricked and otherwise dumbed down the majority, so that the majority gives that minority their power.

Funny thing about the illusion of authority, is that you don't actually need to have any real power or authority. All you need to do is act as if you do and present that glamour scam to people, and they'll happily just surrender their power to you and follow you. Whether we deify someone or demonize them, we are putting them on a pedestal of authority. Whether we call them saintly or call them a boogie man, we are giving them our power.

Its one thing to acknowledge that fire burns, its a whole other to act as if its a demon or a god.

We put all of our faith in idiots and have none in ourselves, like screaming fans at a WWE Match where it doesn't matter whether or not Stone Cold or The Rock wins the match, because Vince McMahon wins no matter who wins. Its all two sides of one corporation. At the end of the day, Stone Cold and The Rock are having drinks at the same bar. They may or may not like each other, but they are playing for the same corporate team.

As Jessie Ventura once said "the reason I've done so well in politics, is because it works exactly like wrestling".

The psychopaths at the top who run this world think that we the masses deserve everything we are getting, because we're choosing to be dumb enough to allow ourselves to get screwed. To a limited point, I agree with them. I think they are wrong for fucking everyone over and destroying humanity in the process, but at the same time -- there is some logic in what they are saying. If someone wants to be hateful, they deserve being hated. If someone wants to be violent, they deserve all the violence that anyone else can unleash against them. If someone enjoys making others suffer, they deserve to suffer themselves. And for those who think that genocide is a reasonable option, those people deserve to be brutally oppressed and murdered. Whether we're talking about the average Joe or the psychos who run things, I think that they all deserve back, exactly what they have been putting out.


Those with kindness and empathy, deserve kindness and empathy in return. Those who do their best to be the best person they can be, deserve to be surrounded by the love, appreciation and support in return for what they give others. And those who think that making others suffer and die is the best way to go, deserve suffering and deserve death. Thankfully, we all reap what we sew.

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FluffyLover1986 In reply to paradigm-shifting [2015-11-18 05:48:30 +0000 UTC]

Yes yes, hate the rich, yadda yadda...

Look bro...I hate the Waltons as much as the next hipster. People like the ones running WalMart are the reason we can't have nice things. So, I'm with you there. Most government officials suck. But that's expected, given the levels of bureaucracy and the shitty pay in most government positions. Seriously, ever tried applying through U.S. Jobs? It's a complete morass and nightmare. And then, the pay sucks anyway. And most politicians are incompetent as well. Some can be decent (E.G. Bernie), but they're few and far-between.

As for "no faith in ourselves", well...dunno what to tell you. I try to do what I can for myself. And yeah, it'd be cool if I could afford a Tesla, and the priciest foods and such, but I can't. I make do with what I have. And yes, I try to avoid the big corporations. After all, the only things I buy are Quest bars, and groceries from the supermarket a couple of blocks away. So no, I'm not supporting any evil asshole corporate overlord out there. Just don't have the money to do so

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paradigm-shifting In reply to FluffyLover1986 [2015-11-18 14:53:41 +0000 UTC]

Are you sure you're not one of those liberal tree hugging hippies yourself? LOL. If there was any more epic of a way for you to completely miss my points, I can't think of how you could accomplish it because you've succeeded with such amazing spectacularness, if thats even a word. lol

I don't even know how to explain to you exactly what sort of dichotomy you just segwayed into. lol

All I can say, is imagine that everything I previously said (this is an analogy, by the way lol) as if it were one physical object you could hold in your hand. Now imagine your mind is a kitchen blender. Now imagine you just stuck it in the blender, and hit the liquefy button. Then you poured it into a glass, held it up and said to me "yeah yeah yeah its gooey and messy, but what does that have to do with the price of tea in china?" as I stand there looking at you with my head tilted 90 degrees, followed by face palming myself. lol

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FluffyLover1986 In reply to paradigm-shifting [2015-11-19 00:07:47 +0000 UTC]

Liberal tree hugging hippies? I'm more a Bill Maher liberal than anything else.

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Divinehearts In reply to FluffyLover1986 [2015-11-17 04:06:07 +0000 UTC]

Yes, thank you!

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paradigm-shifting In reply to segura2112 [2015-11-17 09:53:36 +0000 UTC]

Thank YOU!

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