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SocksTheMutt In reply to PatchestheCalico [2012-05-01 18:22:54 +0000 UTC]

yup D": things just got worse

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PatchestheCalico In reply to SocksTheMutt [2012-05-01 18:28:44 +0000 UTC]

It must have been so hard for him to have to done everything on his own with no one who really gave a crap about him.

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SocksTheMutt In reply to PatchestheCalico [2012-05-01 18:35:47 +0000 UTC]

I know I got a weird look when someone was browsing through my sketchbook a couple weeks ago, they were like "why so much Scar, he's horrible!" What he does is horrible, but I think something equally horrible is to blame for him getting to that point. Plus, I love over-thinking the villains. I just can't stop sketching this stuff *total addict*

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PatchestheCalico In reply to SocksTheMutt [2012-05-01 19:33:27 +0000 UTC]

Yeah, agreed. I overthink the ones that warrant it, and Scar is definitely one that warrants more than just looking at the surface. People don't really think about it, whether they want to not think about it, or just never have taken the time to. Something should strike them as odd for a lion who's friends with supposed 'enemies', and who no other adult lions are around, except to scold him like he's a child.

I'm sure some of what made him was partly his own doing, but if others just gave up on him and expected him to be a punching bag as it seems with the opening scene, then it's not all his fault. I always thought he was much more insightful and indirect of things, and things not said to him affected him more than things directly said to him. Things he overheard but probably wasn't supposed to much moreso. He probably felt inferior with the whole "If you're a king, everyone respects you and loves you" mentality that seems to have been ingrained in his mind, and being weaker and not being able to go out and get his own pride, along with being essentially a 'throw rug' to his currently pride, his route he took was the easiest after he's severed any emotional ties with his brother. Him being weaker is probably why he was allowed to stick around, out of pity, which probably made him feel even more inferior because just waking up knowing why he's there and that he can't go out on his own because of it probably ate at him enough until he did what he did. I really feel for him because the poor guy had nothing. He'd of been much less interesting to me had he been given a loving mate that kept him grounded (ie, NOT a nutjob like Zira supposedly). He definitely needed something to fixate on and keep him happy.

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SocksTheMutt In reply to PatchestheCalico [2012-05-01 20:08:11 +0000 UTC]

I love the way your minds works when it comes to Scar, you just really get him lol. I never thought too much on him not being able to go form his own pride but I agree with you, his lacking in physical strength would have made that nearly impossible. And by having a son Mufasa took away his only chance to ever be anything, he'd forever be in the shadows...in Mufasa's shadow to be exact (one of the things that drives him to madness) I think the only one who honestly loved him was Simba (as an innocent cub) but obviously any sort of (honest) uncle/nephew relationship was ruined from day one (and Simba's prideful bragging didn't help, which I feel might have reminded him of Mufasa. Deja vu (did a picture like that I still need to get scanned lol) And the more I think on it the more I sorta like the theory that Scar befriended the hyenas because he felt like he had the upperpaw with them. For a change he was the strongest; the one in charge (although I also feel he must have got on their good side somehow first, because he'd have been no match for the entire clan and they'd need a pretty good reason to start trusting a lion)

There's one of the reasons I don't like Simba's Pride: it suggests that Scar had a group of loyal followers (and an obsessive fangirl, Zira) But I think he felt unloved even as king, as suggested in "The Madness of King Scar". I really love that song because it sheds more light on his character. "Nobody loved me there's the rub. Not even as a cub." that line always struck me too. I've always considered the musical to be an extended version of the movie; I view it as more cannon than SP. Not a fan of the Scar/Nala scene but let's face it, he was pretty crazy at that point.

I went off on a ramble, sorry XD

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PatchestheCalico In reply to SocksTheMutt [2012-05-01 23:39:58 +0000 UTC]

Well, I get what my interpretation of him is based on what I see and don't see him doing, and who I do and don't see him hanging around. I've always been a pretty good judge of people because I had to be when I grew up. I used to get picked on pretty fiercely in school, so if a bully all of a sudden wanted to be friends and meet me at the playground after school, I learned at an early age that 'always mean to me, then suddenly nice means you're being deceived and are going to get beat up!'. That as a basis, I quickly learned about fake, shallow people who are only interested in you for what you can do for them, and those that are true friend material. Pretty much all that by third grade I had under my belt. Relevant to this, what I saw in Scar was that he was a loner (probably more by choice), lived alone, and that no one appeared to make any efforts to socialize with him unless it was to berate him. Simba was just a dolt I think who wanted to brag to everyone he could about becoming king and Scar was just another lion to tell.

Pretty much all you said above is a nice summary of everything I've said prior. He was stuck and had no way out and did a horrible act to get what I believe in his mind was the only thing he could do to try and take back what he had been denied. I'm really keen on thinking that if Mufasa had handled the "you missed Simba's presentation" event differently, Scar would have just continued moping about the rest of his life, but instead he had to be a pompous regal ass, talk to his brother who I'm sure he knew wanted to be king himself like he was a 'commoner', keep the 'tough guy' attitude until after Scar left. Only then did he seem to lighten up a little and feel sort of sorry for Scar. I really think that how Mufasa handled that was the last straw for Scar. Not only was he not going to be king now, but his brother has to come at him like he's not even related to him anymore and demand in a passive aggressive way why he missed his precious son's presentation, all while rubbing his nose in the fact. If Scar had any last dangling feelings that Mufasa was his brother, I'm sure they were gone with that little scene they had. His opening scene, I didn't see a murderous lion intent on killing his brother and nephew; I saw one who was resigned to the fact that he had been dealt a blow early on in his life (being the smaller of the two and unfit to be king) that affected every aspect of his life going forward.

TLKoB just embellished the movie a bit. I wouldn't consider it quite cannon, but at least someone else kind of picked up that Scar was a character that lacked anyone loving him.

Sorry, now was my turn to ramble. XD

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SocksTheMutt In reply to PatchestheCalico [2012-05-02 09:17:58 +0000 UTC]

I can sorta relate to what you went through too, I was never physically bullied but I was very isolated in school. I literally never talked most of the time (unless I was asked to, in which case I would mumble) Teachers thought I had issues, kids thought I was a freak. I was just always very anti-social and kept to myself and got a lot of crap for it. No one ever really tried to befriend me, and the few that tried to talk to me I pushed away myself thanks to my own social anxiety. I had two friends in school and they were both in different grades from me so we never saw each other at recess etc (and they both moved away eventually) I really think there's a reason people like us love the sorts of characters we do lol. I totally get where you're coming from.

Agree about the opening scene too. Although I never thought too much on it as a kid (I was nine years old when TLK first came out - and lost count of how many times I saw it that summer) I always thought Mufasa had too much of a temper in that scene. He scared me there, not Scar. Nine year old me thought Scar was witty and funny with his "curtsy" line. XD Mufasa was portrayed as such a wise, noble king and loving father, but to his brother...all we ever see is him being a jerk. Treating him like a child sums it up, I agree. It also makes me wonder just how much of an age gap there was between the two. Judging by the nose rim colors (which apparently tells a lion's maturity in the TLK world, or so I've heard/come to figure out) Scar's was pretty dark at the start of the movie. More stuff to ponder though; I have such a bad case of insomnia right now. XD Love these rambles though! Don't apologize for 'em.

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PatchestheCalico In reply to SocksTheMutt [2012-05-02 12:47:22 +0000 UTC]

Understood. Maybe it's we see part of us in Scar, except he had the drive to dig himself out of the hole he was in, at any cost. King of the rejects maybe. X3

I believe personal experiences dictate how people view that scene. Stuck up bratty types, or people who have never known hardship outside of their control see Scar as disrespectful of the situation. To them he should have "dealt with it" and sucked it up, stood by Mufasa and watched as all his hopes and desires were whisked away into oblivion. He would have none of that though.

For types like me, I see him missing it as his only way of getting back at Mufasa in some way. Disrespectful yeah, but honestly, I'm sure there was probably some sort of passive agressive "You had better be there for it." comment to him beforehand. He handled the whole scene much like I would have. lol

Not sure of their age difference though. I've always just assumed Mufasa popped out first, then Scar.

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SocksTheMutt In reply to PatchestheCalico [2012-05-02 17:59:01 +0000 UTC]

Lol you're always putting images in my head, now I'm brainstorming a pre-presentation scene and how it might have played out. I'm sure Mufasa was demanding of Scar to be there, he always seemed very stern and had little patience with him. Damnit Disney, so many things unanswered about just how they got to that point. But that's what makes the fandom fun, I guess.

And yeah, I secretly hated the kids that "fit in" with the populars and got more just because they were born into it. The ones that never really had to friggin struggle for anything. Silver spoon types that really need to walk a mile in someone else's shoes. Life's really not fair, is it. We're all the wiser for it, and richer in a way I think.

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PatchestheCalico In reply to SocksTheMutt [2012-05-02 19:15:27 +0000 UTC]

It's not intentional, I swear. XD

I do weep for him being dealt what he was dealt with very little to no positive support to keep him from 'turning evil'. That's why I so enjoy all the commissions I've had done where I've put Patches with him, post TLK to give him what I believe he's always wanted, and more.

I'd entertained thoughts of writing something about their past leading up to the events where my story starts off, but I almost don't want to so that it can be purposefully vague. I really don't like stories that entertwine with the timeline of the movie, but I'd worked out an idea that where the hyenas or lionesses thought Scar was going mad talking to himself was really when he and Patches were meeting or arguing (with Patches wanting to keep himself hidden from everyone still for whatever reason). I'd also had to show how narrow minded Scar was once he was king and that there was no hope of him changing while king, which leads into a lot of what I have in my story, and the irony of how Patches was calling it quits and just by chance happened to go and do it on the night Simba shows up.

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SocksTheMutt In reply to PatchestheCalico [2012-05-02 21:01:34 +0000 UTC]

I love the pictures of him with Patches, always so sweet...and always so much emotion in them, I love that. I love emotional pictures of Scar in general, but usually they're sad. XD With Patches it's happy - and sad too of course, with Scar's struggles. I think that's one of the things I love though...it's like finding your heart. *is a total sap, I know*

I think I've only ever written one story that takes place during the movie's timeline and I kept it short on purpose. I sorta like exploring the "unseen" parts of the movie (we never really see much of Scar's reign - I would have rather seen more of that than the "hakuna matata" story we got in 1/2) but I always get paranoid when writing inbetween the movie's scenes. Afraid I'll go off track and mess up the plot somehow. XD

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PatchestheCalico In reply to SocksTheMutt [2012-05-02 21:44:44 +0000 UTC]

I'm glad at least someone does. X3 With what I've had done that you've probably seen sofar, I like the bittersweet happiness he has because it seems much more realistic and believable.

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