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t-writes-poems — a voice for the voiceless.
Published: 2009-01-22 11:23:18 +0000 UTC; Views: 5043; Favourites: 112; Downloads: 8
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thirty-six years ago today...the case of roe v. wade changed america forever, ruling
the genocide of innocent preborn children as a
constitutional act.
since that day, over 50 million tiny, voiceless children
have been slaughtered in its name.
thirty-six years ago.
how is this still going on?
there is no pro-choice.
the baby has no choice in his or her death; why should
the mother? after all, aren't we all created equal?
and if a choice truly must be made, it should be made
before the point of conception. not after.
give them a voice.
overturn roe v. wade.
it's a child, not a choice.
credit...
pregnant woman silhouette: [link]
(c)
Related content
Comments: 290
I stated in my deviantart that I was anti-abortion and this deviant commented on my page that I was 'Anti-feminist'
"You don't believe in woman's right to choose.''
No, I don't believe in choosing to murder a child who has no voice. I love you for making this, it's a great piece of art! Ha ha I saw this when I visited your page and I thought 'Finally someone who agrees..'
My sister told me that within a week of conception, the fetus gains a heartbeat and if you kill anything with a heartbeat; that makes it murder.
So why are people saying that fetuses are not living? :/
Sorry, abortion is a really touchy subject. Especially with me, my sister lost a friend because she wouldn't pay for her friend's abortion. or help pay.
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Well-said. And yeah, I don't believe in a woman's "right to choose" to kill an unborn baby any more than I believe in a man's "right to choose" to rape a woman. Or a parent's "right to choose" to abuse their child. There are quite a lot of choices to make in this world, but some of them are just wrong choices.
Some people just refuse to understand that. The logic is there, the evidence is there, but they just 'choose' to be ignorant.
Anyway, now I'm ranting, haha. I'm glad you're standing up for the unborn and I'm glad you like this piece! :]
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I agree, people just don't want to take responsibility for their actions. Like that girl I had mentioned in my journal, who is constantly running away from her mistakes. It'll always catch up with you. Though I had a discussion with a friend, who isn't for abortion but thinks it's okay when the mother's life is at risk.
But I know of a woman, she's in a wheelchair and can't move most of her body. She had a perfectly healthy baby boy, though the doctors wanted to terminate the pregnancy when she first got pregnant. She refused, 'If I die and this child lives then that's fine with me.' I believe that's what she said.
I highly respect her for that. Though it must've been a difficult situation on her family's part.
If a person who can't move can keep their baby though they weren't supposed to be pregnant, why is it okay for a perfectly healthy 'mother' to terminate her baby just because she can't afford it?
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Completely agreed.
And actually, the head of Planned Parenthood (which is the largest abortion provider in the US) once stated that because of today's technology and medical advances, there is pretty much no case in which a unborn child would have to be killed to save the mother's life. Pretty interesting fact.
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That's good! That's what got me the most, because I didn't know if it could be helped or not. I mean when my mother gave birth to me she got really sick, well probably because I'm her seventh child; so she had to stop trying to get pregnant. I'm glad there's new technology to help.
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I want to support you with this. This is a bold, beautiful work of art, and I want to personally thank you for putting it out. It's a brave move, and it's kind of sad (and somewhat surprising) that so many people are bashing you, politely or otherwise, for speaking your opinion; and what I would say is the truth.
Thank you for having the knowledge, the courage, and the patience to fight a battle which I and many others would personally be too tired to fight.
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Wow, thank you so much for your kind words!
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With your permission, I'd like to this out and hang it on my wall. Not only is it a beautiful peice of artwork, but it embodies how I feel about the issue as well. I love it ^_^
May I?
~Sun and Moon
~Shaliken
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Thank you!
And you certainly may, I'd feel honored. :]
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Sweet
And you are very welcome
~Sun and Moon
~Shaliken
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I could go into the same arguments and reasons that have been mentioned already but I don't want an argument. I think that our views are just incompatable (if that's the right way to put it). I could never agree to your views and you could never agree to mine so shall we agree to disagree on this?
Anyway, I really like the way this piece has been produced even if I don't agree with the message. It looks really good.
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Agreeing to disagree sounds good.
And thank you so much for your kind words, even if you don't agree with this piece - I really respect you for that. :]
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Not a problem - we both want the same things; less abortion or practically none anyway. Just have different methods.
Thanks for your kind response too
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I <333 this piece. it's SO sad that people punish those for murdering adults but allow the murder of BABIES. it's incomprehensible...
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Thank you!
And I know exactly what you mean. I just can't understand how anyone can justify that kind of cruelty in this world.
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if I could I would adopt all the "unwanted" children in the world. I would love them and tell them everyday that they are wanted and treasured. but alas it's impossible :[
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Same here. There's no such thing as an "unwanted child," because there's always somebody in the world wants that child to be alive and to be loved and cared for, whether that person is one of his or her biological parents or not. I just wish people would see and understand that all children are beautiful gifts. <3
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in total agreement
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This is beautiful. Hopefully it will change some hearts.
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Thanks, and I hope it will, too.
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This picture really speaks!
I'm actually doing a persuasive paper on abortion right now, but I'm sitting here giving people llamas instead of writing. XD
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Thanks! And hehehe. XD
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I absolutely love this piece. And after reading the comments you got...you do a fantastic job with explaining things. <3
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Funny, people are focusing more on a fictional book/movie by Dr. Seuss rather than an important and disturbing subject.
I agree with you. Totally, and all the way. The only difference between abortion and murder that occurs outside of the womb is that the victim doesn't get to cry for help.
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AMEN TO THAT!!! I think we (as deviants) should fight this. Perhaps... make a group? It sounds like a good idea to me.
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That's definitely an awesome idea. I never really caught on to the whole groups thing, but I think I'll look into it.
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That'd be really cool/neat/awesome. A voice for the voiceless. Warriors of the Word!
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Sorry, if you see this as rude, but I have to disagree with you. I think you are biased and misinformed. I think if you really cared about women and women's issues then you wouldn't imply they should be punished for sex or for being raped by being forced to carry pregnancies against their will.
- Planned Parenthood was created to help women and their families and educate about birth control. And whether Margaret Sanger was racist or not has no bearing on the ethics of abortion. She was also a big proponent of contraception--does that make condoms evil?
Anti-choicers always use that racism kkk nazi argument, but the fact is it was praised and supported by even Dr. Martin Luther King Jr for it's aid to minorities. Was he bigotted against African Americans too? And I have Jewish friends whose family members are holocaust survivors and guess what? they're pro-choice, are members of Planned Parenthood and Aleph, an organization that helps women in crisis, and have a good an education in womens issues. In fact they admires Dr. Gisela Perle, who practiced abortion in Auschwitz to save women's lives and Henry Morgentaler, who was an Auschwitz survivor. [link]
[link]
Dr. Morgantaler, an abortion provider who has been nominated to the highest Canadian honor for his work, survived Auschwitz and saw the horrors of man's cruelty to man. Although not mentioned, it is likely he witnessed what happened to pregnant women in the camps. He studied medicine and fought for the underdog, even going to prison in Canada. At that time, attempting to induce an abortion was a crime punishable by life in prison, or two years imprisonment if the woman herself was convicted.
[link]
- All the women I've met who have had abortions felt a certain amount of anguish over having to make the decision, but once they do decide and have the procedure done, the usual feeling is one of relief. The guilt, if any, is often the result of harrassment by opponents of abortion. Adoption works just fine for some women, and more power to them. But for others, the pregnancy itself is the problem. Our culture tends to idolize motherhood, and puts an idyllic "public face" on pregnancy: the radiant, mother-to-be, basking in the contented bliss of her own fecundity. We don't like to think about this...
* exhaustion (weariness common from first weeks)
* altered appetite and senses of taste and smell
* nausea and vomiting (50% of women, first trimester)
* heartburn and indigestion
* constipation
* weight gain
* dizziness and light-headedness
* bloating, swelling, fluid retention
* hemmorhoids
* abdominal cramps
* yeast infections
* congested, bloody nose
* acne and mild skin disorders
* skin discoloration (chloasma, face and abdomen)
* mild to severe backache and strain
* increased headaches
* difficulty sleeping, and discomfort while sleeping
* increased urination and incontinence
* bleeding gums
* pica
* breast pain and discharge
* swelling of joints, leg cramps, joint pain
* difficulty sitting, standing in later pregnancy
* inability to take regular medications
* shortness of breath
* higher blood pressure
* hair loss
* tendency to anemia
* curtailment of ability to participate in some sports and activities
* infection including from serious and potentially fatal disease
(pregnant women are immune suppressed compared with non-pregnant women, and
are more susceptible to fungal and certain other diseases)
* extreme pain on delivery
* hormonal mood changes, including normal post-partum depression
* continued post-partum exhaustion and recovery period
* stretch marks (worse in younger women)
* loose skin
* permanent weight gain or redistribution
* abdominal and vaginal muscle weakness
* pelvic floor disorder (occurring in as many as 35% of middle-aged
former child-bearers and 50% of elderly former child-bearers, associated
with urinary and rectal incontinence, discomfort and reduced quality of
life)
* changes to breasts
* varicose veins
* scarring from episiotomy or c-section
* other permanent aesthetic changes to the body (all of these are
downplayed by women, because the culture values youth and beauty)
* increased proclivity for hemmorhoids
* loss of dental and bone calcium (cavities and osteoporosis)
* hyperemesis gravidarum
* temporary and permanent injury to back
* severe scarring requiring later surgery (especially after additional
pregnancies)
* dropped (prolapsed) uterus (especially after additional pregnancies,
and other pelvic floor weaknesses -- 11% of women, including cystocele,
rectocele, and enterocele)
* pre-eclampsia (edema and hypertension, the most common complication of
pregnancy, associated with eclampsia, and affecting 7 - 10% of pregnancies)
* eclampsia (convulsions, coma during pregnancy or labor, high risk of
death)
* gestational diabetes
* placenta previa
* anemia (which can be life-threatening)
* thrombocytopenic purpura
* severe cramping
* embolism (blood clots)
* medical disability requiring full bed rest (frequently ordered during
part of many pregnancies varying from days to months for health of either
mother or baby)
* diastasis recti, also torn abdominal muscles
* mitral valve stenosis (most common cardiac complication)
* serious infection and disease (e.g. increased risk of tuberculosis)
* hormonal imbalance
* ectopic pregnancy (risk of death)
* broken bones (ribcage, "tail bone")
* hemorrhage and numerous other complications of delivery
* refractory gastroesophageal reflux disease
* aggravation of pre-pregnancy diseases and conditions (e.g. epilepsy is
present in .5% of pregnant women, and the pregnancy alters drug metabolism
and treatment prospects all the while it increases the number and frequency
of seizures)
* severe post-partum depression and psychosis
* research now indicates a possible link between ovarian cancer and
female fertility treatments, including "egg harvesting" from infertile women
and donors
* research also now indicates correlations between lower breast cancer
survival rates and proximity in time to onset of cancer of last pregnancy
* research also indicates a correlation between having six or more
pregnancies and a risk of coronary and cardiovascular disease
- Legal abortion is safer and less costly than childbirth. The death rate from childbirth in first-world countries where abortion is illegal is about ten times as high as the death rate from abortion, and the rate of complications is about 30 times higher. Abortion is, in fact, safer than a penicillin injection and about 11 times as safe as carrying a pregnancy to term.
[link]
The list of possible complications from that is tiny compared to the list of complications from pregnancy.
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- Over 70% of Anti-choicers are men, 100% of them will never be pregnant
- States that ban abortion have the lowest funds for adoption & foster care. And with so many kids in adoption, who WILL adopt them? Once these kids are born, they're essentially abandoned to adoption. I can't name one person I know who's anti-abortion that adopted a kid. Also, with the nation's poor increasing, who's gonna afford extra kids adopted? The rich or well-to-do aren't adopting much either.
[link]
Over 500,000 children in the U.S. currently reside in some form of foster care, without being adopted
[link]
Worldwide adoption agencies are practically swamped with a huge majority of children who go unadopted (which, in truly impoverished nations, can possibly lead to horrific results such as the illegal sale of orphans into human trafficking). As recently as 2006, adoption statistics have actually dropped about 10% to 15% in the top countries.
[link]
- Welfare programs have been significantly reduced over the past few years. Paraphrasing from answers.com (and my history textbook), regulated welfare programs were formulated during Franklin D.Roosevelt's presidency. Between the Great Depression and WWII, medicare, medicaid, public housing, food stamps, etc. etc. arose to support victims of the depression. However, as the U.S. started moving beyond its depression years, unemployment dropped; however, a lingering percentage still had no intention of finding a job. Welfare programs were thus criticized for creating a system of dependency. During the 1990s and beyond, states started experimenting with welfare and implementing systems that require people to work. In 1996, President Clinton signed a bill (heavily supported by Republicans) that eradicated some welfare programs and only supplied states with a block grant. Under this law, government funds can only support a family for five years (maximum). So, welfare programs fail to provide adequate support for working mothers because of these growing limitations. Raising a child is expensive
- The costs of raising a baby to age 18 costs between $125,000-$250,000 and that's not including college tuition! In your baby's first year alone, you can easily spend between $9,000-$11,000 (for diapers, formula, baby furniture, clothing, baby gear, etc.) If you go back to work right away,childcare can cost as much as $3,000-$4,500 in your baby's first year. If you can stay home with your baby, you can save money....
Crib with mattress- $160-$750
Crib bedding set- $35-$270
Crib blankets (4-6)- $8-$40 each
Fitted crib sheets (2)- $8-$20 each
Water-proof mattress cover- $10-$20
Bassinet or cradle- $35-$260
Changing table- $70-$600
Changing pad & cover- $25-$50
Dresser- $90-$650
Rocker or glider- $90-$500
Car seat- $35-$280
Stroller or travel system- $30-$300
Playpen or porta-crib- $60-$180
Swing- $45-$130
Play center or walker- $50-$125
Mobile- $25-$70
Baby carrier or sling- $20-$140
Monitor- $20-$230
Baby gate- $35-$250
Bouncer seat- $30-$90
Toy box- $25-$90
Gym or play mat- $25-$90
Doorway jumper- $25-$60
High chair- $45-$240
Diaper bag- $10-$60
Diaper pail- $20-$45 Refills- $15-$20 (3 pack)
Thermometer- $10-$90
First aid supplies (kit)- $20-$30
Humidifier or vaporizer- $15-$130
Bottles 8 oz & 4 oz (8-10)- $10-$20 (3 pack) or $20-$40 (starter set)
Bottle warmer- $18-$35
Sterilizer- $30-$70
Breast pump & accessories- $45-$350
Breastfeeding pillow- $20-$35
Bath tub or seat- $15-$35
Hooded towels (4)- $6-$30 each
Wipes (a lot)- $4-$5 (pack)
Clothes for first year- $500-$1,200
Smaller items: Washcloths, diaper rash ointment/powder, nail clippers, nasal aspirator, baby wash/lotion/oil/shampoo, pacifiers, extra nipples for bottles, bottle brush, breastfeeding pads, burp cloths/ lap pads, bibs, receiving blankets, car seat head support (for newborns), toys & more toys.
[link]
Therefore, unless someone can persuade the working middle class of the U.S. to pay more taxes for unwanted babies and welfare programs that seemingly generates "dependency" on federal funds, denying abortions to woman and having them deal with these lifelong costs without support is unreasonable. It is very difficult to get an adequately paying job without a high school diploma, a few degrees, and college graduation. For the percentage of
pregnant women who are teen mothers-to-be, the job market for them is very isolated.
The way I see it, if you're going to force every woman to give birth to their babies, then you better damn be ready to fund all the adoption centers and foster care programs that will be needed. It will take an increase in taxes to cover the care of the children in the adoption agencies and foster homes. The sorts of things that a lot of people say is not applicable to them, and should not be something they have to pay for. The typical argument is "Hey, why should I have to pay for someone else's kid?"
My answer is "Hey. Because you wanted to force them to have it instead of letting them get an abortion."
And if you are still focused only on the future of the fetus, it will not be the only one suffering, should it be permitted to live-- countless others will be unecessarily affected as a result, both directly and indirectly. An average baby will use over 6,000 diapers in two years. These things do not bio-degrade for millions of years, and they take up unbelieveable amounts of space in landfills, requiring more land be cleared for dumping. I'll only touch upon the amount of soil erosion, water pollution, and habitat loss that entails. Then there is actually feeding the child-- the amount of food a mother must consume to generate enough milk for it, or the amount of food that cows or goats must consume, should parents decide to use formula. Nevermind the fact that the animals must be repeatedly forced into pregnancy for them to lactate, only to have their young taken away (usually for veal) so that the milk can be harvested for marketing. Keep in mind, these are only the most closely-tied examples of child-induced suffering.
- [link] is a great article of the behaviour shown by many members of those who profess to be opposed to abortion.
More links
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Here are some interesting facts and PoV (based on both research and opinion):
Is a fetus a human being? Can it be considered a legal person with rights?
A fetus has rarely been considered a human being. They are different from human beings in several key ways:
1) The fetus depends on the mother to survive.
2) Human beings, by definition, are unique and separate individuals.
3) Rights cannot be transferred from person to person. The fetus, although living inside the mother, does not gain the priviledge to gain such status and rights.
4) Fetuses would have to be tax and property payers to become "a legal person with rights."
5) American citizenship is described as anyone "born or naturalized in the U.S."
6) The global declaration of human rights states, "All human beings are born free and equal in dignity and rights." Does this include fetuses, clumps of cells not technically born yet?
Does a fetus have a right to life?
- Most anti-abortion viewers argue "yes." However, they do commonly show sympathy for rape victims or mothers who have high-risk pregnancies. In these situations, anti-choicers are showing that the mother's health and well-being are more valuable than the life of a fetus.
- If a fetus did have the right to life, what's to stop the state from forcing people to donate organs, blood, etc. to save another individual? If a fetus is considered a human being, is the mother obligated to save it and give it an opportunity to live? How is this different from saving an actual human being suffering from a life-threatening disease with few matching donors?
I'm going to reiterate my stance on the issue: It doesn't really matter whether human fetuses are people. What matters is whether *women* are people, because people are not obligated to use their bodies as life-support for other people. If you *truly* believe that women are people, neither more nor less completely than any other sort of people, then you must be in favor of reproductive rights. To oppose abortion rights is to say, in effect, that a fetus has a greater claim on a woman's body than *she herself* does. And that makes her something *less* than a person.
Though, obviously, I must confess that my views on abortion are colored by the fact that I have a working body and womb, and no desire (at present or in the foreseeable future) to loan it out to anyone or anything.
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I am not misinformed, nor am I biased. A child is not a "punishment," nor is being pregnant.
- Statistics show that Planned Parenthood's biggest focus is abortion - that's where a majority of their money comes from. Regardless of whether or not the beginnings of the organization were ethical or not does not have any bearing on abortion - you're right. Whether or not PP have "good" intentions, abortion is still wrong.
Martin Luther King, Jr was pro-life - his niece is a very big anti-abortion advocate.
I'll leave you with this read on the matter: [link]
Hitler and the Nazis were very pro-abortion, by the way. [link]
- Wow, you make pregnancy sound like a deadly disease there... it's not. It's natural, normal, and beautiful. Abortion has effects, mental, emotional, and physical, that last far beyond nine months. Not to mention someone always ends up dead. There are many women who regret their abortions, but whether or not they do feel guilt or not does not affect the morality of abortion. Someone could verbally and physically abuse their child and not feel guilt; someone could kill their husband and not feel guilt; hey, someone could cheat on a test and not feel guilt. Does a person's feeling of guilt or lack thereof make something ethically/morally right?
- Abortion is NOT safer than childbirth. It is in fact four times deadlier. [link]
- I don't know where you're getting THAT statistic, but I do know 49% of women are pro-life and 44% are "pro-choice". Single white males between the ages of 20 and 45 are the most pro-abortions... escaping responsibility much?
- You know what? I agree with you there. There needs to be more funding for adoption. And the adoption process needs to be improved.
Also, "I can't name one person I know who's anti-abortion that adopted a kid." Um... I'm pretty sure you're joking here. Do you know ANYONE that's adopted a kid?
Did you know that there are more families wanting to adopt than there are children up for adoption? It's just the process is so complicated and messed up that it doesn't work right. That needs to be fixed, yes. I totally agree with you there. But that's a problem for the adoption industry to solve, NOT the abortion industry.
- Yeah, raising a child is expensive. But you know what? I'm being raised by a single working father. He's not on welfare. It can be done. And you know, what would you say if a mother has her child and realizes five years down the road that she just can't afford the child's needs anymore? Would you tell her to just "get rid of" the child? To kill it? No? Well then, how does abortion solve this problem? If a woman, can't afford a child, why doesn't she exercise her *freedom of choice* to be responsible and abstain from sex? Just a suggestion...
Listen, you can make all the points you want, but here's what it comes down to: Taxes, environmental issues, whatever, they have nothing to do with the value of a human life. Someone is either a human or they are not, and if they are a human, they deserve to be treated as any other human being. They have the right to life and equality. No questions asked, no matter the consequences. If we begin to compromise the basic right to life, we have nothing left.
Biologically, a fetus is a human being. What else could it be? A dog? A cat? A fish? No, it's parents are humans, therefore it MUST be a human. Any first grader could tell you that much.
1) Newborns depends on their mothers to survive, too. Let's kill them whenever we want, too, hmm?
2) So is a fetus. It has its own separate body parts, its own DNA, its own body... and thus, its own rights. Separate DNA is present from the point of conception. And are you going to say that a pregnant woman has two brains, two hearts, two reproductive systems (and in half the cases... a male reproductive system?!). Pshhh, no. Those are the BABY'S separate, unique body parts.
3) I have no idea what you're trying to say here...
4) I don't pay taxes, and won't for a few more years. I'm still a legal person with rights.
5) That's a citizen, not a person. Are you trying to say that anyone not born in America isn't a person? That's crazy talk.
6) Looks like that declaration's going to have to be altered. ;] Personhood has faced boundaries of race and gender in the past that have been triumphed - this boundary can be overcome, too.
Honey, don't you dare compare me to "most pro-lifers." You can't argue the morality of something just by degrading those who support or oppose it. And don't you dare say "most pro-lifers" are heartless. Get real. I have the deepest sympathy for rape victims. How could anyone not? Those poor women go through hell, and it's absolutely disgusting that any man could violate her rights like that. But the violence of abortion doesn't cure the violence of rape - one's actions do not define the rights of a totally innocent person. And Alan Guttmacher, former head of Planned Parenthood, once stated that with today's medical technology, there is no case in which a woman would need an abortion to save her life. But rape cases and high-risk cases alike make up less than 1% of all abortions. Hmmm. In any case, abortion is never the answer.
The state can't ever FORCE anyone to donate ANYTHING. What are you talking about?
It DOES matter that the fetus is a person, just as much that it matters that the woman is a person. Each are separate, unique, beautiful individuals who deserve equal rights, no matter their size, stage of development, environment, or level of dependency. No one has greater rights than any others, and anyone can make whatever choices they want for themselves - as long as that choice does not infringe upon the rights of another. In 99% of cases, women already made the choice to have sex - children are obviously a product of sex. If a woman does not understand that and is not willing to take that "risk," then she should more carefully evaluate her choices on whether or not to engage in sexual behavior.
And I think I just need to add as a disclaimer, I probably sound really harsh right now, and I apologize. I've had a long day and I'm kind of in a really pissy mood, so forgive me if I sound really mean. Not trying to be, I promise. >.<
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I do compare you to the typical anti-women or anti-choicer and I disagree with you 99% on everything. Clinics are not terrorized and docters are not murdered in churches in the name of the pro-choice movement.
Yes, pregnancy and childbirth are natural, and wonderful *for a woman who wants it*, but for a woman who *doesn't*, it can be a nightmare.
In my view, your movement is not so much about "protecting the unborn" as it is about punishing women for having sex and being rape victims by forcing them to go through with unplanned, *unwanted* pregnancies. "The stupid, selfish slut shouldn't have had sex or let herself be raped in the first place, so let's make her carry the pregnancy no matter what. That'll teach her a lesson!" Sorry, but a pregnancy should *not* be a consequence, a punishment or a time-out.
And sorry, the rights of a zygote/embry/fetus in the womans womb end where the *woman's* begins, and the old "If you don't want a baby don't have sex" argument doesn't cut it, not for rape victims. It's not the womans fault if she was raped either, so why punish her by forcing her to relive that trauma every day for nine months?
If a woman or girl wants an abortion, no matter what, no matter what you offer her, what then? Arrest her, lock her away and tie her down for nine months? And if she has an abortion, life in jail, the death penalty? That sounds allot like reproductive slavery to me. And what about the girls and women who *die along with the fetus* in dangerous do-it-yourself or back alley abortions, or are they none of the anti-woman anti-choice movements concern?
You can't compare killing a zygote/embryo/fetus living inside and off of a womans body to killing an already born child who is not. Is cracking an egg the same as killing a chicken? Is crushing a seed the same as destroying an old growth tree?
And I repeat, if people are not forced in any way to donate their blood or organs to keep another person from dying, then why should they be made to donate the insides of their bodies and wombs *against their will?* What gives a person the right to hijack another unwilling persons body to sustain themselves? We are not walking incubators and broodmares, dear.
Bottom line, my womb and body are *my own* and only *I* have the right to decide weather the blueprints for another person is allowed to live and develop inside of it or not. It's nobody's business but my own and my docter's. Maybe someday everyone will remain chaste until they want babies, maybe someday all protection will work perfectly, maybe someday there will be no rape, maybe someday there will be no health complications with pregnancy and childbirth, maybe someday there will be no more unwanted children in foster care, maybe someday they will develop an artificial womb so a woman can relieve herself of an unwanted pregnancy without destroying the zygote/embryo/fetus, maybe someday women will not have to pay money for everything that's needed for pregnancy, childbirth and motherhood for eighteen plus years, but until then, I'm pro-choice and I support abortion being kept as a safe and legal option. *End of discussion*.
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Dear, I'm not going around killing people in the name of life. That's just stupid and hypocritical and pisses me off as much as it does any other sane human being. Those people are NOT pro-life, so you can cut that crap. Pro-lifers are being killed by pro-choicers, too. I'm not going to compare you to those pro-choicers because I assume you're a more intelligent person than they are. However, your being so judgmental is not helping that assumption.
It is difficult, but there IS help for those women who are facing that difficulty. Abortion ISN'T the only option, as the pro-choice camp is advocating it to be.
And in any case, I truly think being aborted is even more of a nightmare. Who wants their life to end this way? [link]
And oh yes, of course, we pro-lifers hate women, don't we? We just want everyone in the world to suffer! Just like those who were anti-slavery wanted to free slaves so the slave owners could suffer, right? Man. We are such terrible people. That's why we set up Crisis Pregnancy Centers to help women deal with the mental, emotional, and physical factors in unwanted/difficult pregnancies. We're just horrible people out to get women, aren't we?
Are you aware of how ridiculous you sound? Really, now...
Disregarding the fact that pregnancy by rape is extremely rare, you CANNOT cure violence with more violence. Studies show that abortion after rape is psychologically worse for a woman to go through than just rape itself and just lengthens her recovery time. In addition, as a pro-life doctor once stated, to assume abortion is the answer to rape degrades women and assumes they can't deal with hardship in their lives. I'd say that's a pretty anti-woman approach. There is absolutely nothing about abortion that would ever relieve a woman of the pain of rape. Rape is horrible enough on its own without added unnecessary pain and violence.
No one said anything about jail, nor the death penalty, so I don't understand where you're going with that...
I believe any woman who seek abortions need guidance and love, not legal punishment, because a women in such emotional distress is just as concerning as their babies' lives in danger. But, wait, oh no! I'm supposed to be anti-woman! I can't possibly think that, can I? Oh no! Forgive me! Crisis Pregnancy Centers help women deal with the stress of unwanted pregnancies in ways that are healthy for everyone - mother and child - and provide for them both if the mother cannot. Oh man! That's not anti-woman either! Oops, my bad!
Why can't you compare the killing of born and unborn? They're just in a different stage of development. Can you say that both the killing of an infant and a preteen are wrong? That's not any different - they, too, are just two human beings in different stages of human development.
A child is not hijacking the woman's body - a child is not a terrorist. The child is its own separate, unique human being, and to grow within its mother is a natural thing, much unlike cutting someone open to donate organs or sticking them with a needle to retrieve blood.
Bottom line, a unborn child's body is HIS or HER own and THEY have the right to it just as much as a woman has to hers. One's liberties end when they infringe on the rights of another. A woman has the choice to do what she wishes with her body - she can dye her hair, paint her nails, shave her legs, whatever. But she can't shoot someone, stab someone, kill someone, abuse someone - those choices infringe on another's rights, just like abortion. Just like a man's choice to rape a woman infringe on her rights. A man can do what he wishes with his body, too - but when he chooses to use sex to infringe on another's rights, that choice is invalid and very, very wrong.
It is impossible to have abortion be a safe option - someone is always left dead and, more often than not, the other is left wounded.
I hope someday you'll see abortion for what it really is.
I also hope someday you'll learn to not be so judgmental and assume things of those who disagree with you; that most certainly gets you nowhere.
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I have about lost count of all the clinics terrorized and docters attacked and killed in the name of the "pro-life" movement, so don't give me that. And yes, the anti-woman anti-choice movement is just that because *they want to deny women their reproductive rights!* "Oh, you're pregnant and you don't want to be? Well, tough you're going through with it anyway because you're just a walking incubator. You shouldn't have let yourself be raped or had sex in the first place, slut."
[link]
You really don't understand, do you? The rights of the unborn end where the rights of the *already born* begin. That's just common sense. And a woman has every right to decide if another person gets to live and develop in *her body and womb* or not. Just like I am not obligated to donate my blood, tissue or organs so another person can live, neither am I obligated to donate my womb.
A woman is not living inside of a man's body, so he has no right to force himself on her in any way. A newborn or a child is no longer living inside someone elses body, so nobody has the right to harm or kill them. And slaves were not living inside other people's bodies either. Simple. Besides, forcing a woman to carry a pregnancy and go through with childbirth *against her will* is really no better then slavery.
And pregnancy crises centres are only helpful for women who WANT to go through with their unplanned pregnancy and give birth. For women who DON'T that is what legal safe abortions are for. Forced pregnancys are not the answer either, dear. If I became pregnant by rape or botched protection and I didn't want to go through with the pregnancy and childbirth no matter what my reasons, no pregnancy crises centre could do anything about it.
You don't have to like abortion, and you certainly don't have to have one if you don't want it, but keep *your* religion, *your* beliefs and opinions out of mine and other women's bodies and wombs.
That is all I have left to say here because it is clear we are never going to agree on this issue.
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Congrats, you are the single most judgmental pro-choicer I have ever spoken to. Now be right back, I've got to go let some pregnant women know that they're no-good worthless sluts and bomb some abortion clinics and stuff, because, you know, that's what I do. The anti-abortion movement OBVIOUSLY isn't about love of both the mother and child it's CLEARLY about hating and oppressing everyone. Gotcha.
Why are the rights of the born more important than the rights of the unborn? How can we value human life if we put someone else's rights over another's and do not treat all humans EQUAL. "We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are CREATED equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are LIFE..." How can we discriminate against one person in favor of the rights of another? That's wrong.
If a couple has a child and that child lives inside their home, is it anybody's business if the couple abuses the child? After all, the child is living in THEIR home, which is their own property and no one can tell them what to do with it, so I guess it's THEIR business what they do in their own home, regardless of whether anyone is hurt, right?
Actually, Crisis Pregnancy Centers are for ANY woman that needs help, ANY woman that's confused in her pregnancy. They give women the alternatives to abortion that Planned Parenthood and the like would never offer. No one is "forced" into pregnancy unless that woman was raped (and pregnancy only results from rape 0.6% of the time), and in that case, although it is immensely difficult, you can't punish another human being for a crime someone committed. You can't fight violence with violence. You're up in arms about violent "pro-lifers" bombing clinics and shooting abortionists - they don't get that. You can't fight abortion by killing those who support it, and you can't fight rape by killing the innocent children produced by it. If a woman is married and has a child, and her husband cheats on her, and the two divorce, every day for the rest of her life, the child reminds the woman of the emotional pain she went through because of her husband's affair, does she have the right to kill the child? No. She doesn't.
If you don't like slavery, you certainly don't have to own slaves if you don't want to, but let other people do what they want. If you don't like genocide, you certainly don't have to kill others, but let people do what they want. Does it work like that?
If something is WRONG, someone has every right to stand up against it. Genocide, oppression, anything. I don't like rape, I have never been raped, but I can say that rape is a horrible thing and I am going to stand against it. If something is wrong, it's not enough to say, "Well, I'm not ever going to rape someone, but you go and make your own decisions, okay?" Rape is wrong no matter who does it, just like oppression, just like genocide, just like abortion. Every human being has the right - and duty - to stand up against horribly wrong things that are happening in the world.
And wait... religion? Who said anything at all about religion? Just because I'm pro-life does not mean I'm religious - in fact, my religion has nothing at all to do with my pro-life stance. I was pro-life before I even had a religion. So, once again, making assumptions. Goodness.
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Very, very good. I'm with you all the way.
"Abortion Stops a Beating Heart"
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No abortion! Stop the massacre: Those children have NO fault! It's not their fault as to how they were conceived. People should learn to be more sensitive.
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Amen!
And thank you for the fave, yet again. :]
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what if it's a rape victims baby?
there's a lot of different perspectives to consider.
although, i do agree on the whole Mother Teresa quote in a different sense. this was a very controversial deviation to put up, but kudos for just that. voicing with a raw passion is refreshing.
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I've thought a lot about the different perspectives, and it all comes down to the fact that we can't make any justifications to simply throw away another human being's life.
Rape IS a difficult area, because rape is such a horrible thing. The woman is FORCED to have sex, and then if she becomes pregnant, she's been FORCED to become a mother (yes, there is already a baby alive in her womb, so she is already technically a mother.) It's terrible to have such life-changing things happen to her without her consent. But see, the thing I've realized is that the definition of rape where one person uses their wants and desires to violate the rights of another person, and that's what abortion is, too. And in this case, two wrongs certainly do not make things right. Killing the baby will not take away the fact that the woman was raped, it will only add the guilt of murder to the woman's conscience and bring another innocent victim into the horrible situation. Refer to this page: [link]
And a person's conception does not determine how valuable they are in life. Murder is murder, no matter the circumstances, no matter who the baby's father is, no matter what. Every human life is priceless and precious, and we can't just say, "Oh, it's okay to kill that one because it's a rapebaby." That's just disgusting.
Yes, it's hard for the woman, but instead of damaging another human life in an already painful situation, we must provide the pregnant woman with support and love and a helping hand in caring for her unborn child. And if she chooses not to keep her baby after birth, then there are plenty of couples who would love to adopt that baby and care for him or her in ways the birth mother could not.
So that's how I see it. :]
Sorry for the long winded response, haha. Thanks.
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that's true, adoption is a good substitute to abortion.
well at least you back up your view although i only some what agree but for me i'd never get an abortion.
but i dunno, sometimes i guess it's the only choice it the narrowest of situations.
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I know what you mean, but like I said, even in those though situations, murder is NEVER the way out. There are always other options that are safe for both mother and child, and instead of having pro-"choice" groups promote abortion, they should be promoting the choices that harm no one and violate no one's rights.
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