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Feed Your Models - 2
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Published: 2008-07-21 01:34:29 +0000 UTC; Views: 40970; Favourites: 966; Downloads: 1291
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Description
This is intended as a counterpart to [link]Kaitlin is skinny. A lot of times, images of her garner catty remarks about how she needs to eat more, or whatever. Anyhow... I'd been thinking of doing a shot of her sitting in a corner with a plate with a single baked bean on it, but then I realized that it'd be pretty hard to see what was going on. Besides, the nasty remarks are often unsubtle - which means an unsubtle image is more likely to work.
Anyhow, I find it amazing that people are so concerned about whether a complete stranger is fat, or thin, or tattooed, or - whatever. As if it's their business, somehow? Well, if it's my business, I make sure my models are well-fed.
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Comments: 585
That's not true at all. We would not have a term known as "Good Samaritans" if it were.
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If someone passes out from hunger on the street, by all means, help them.
But, do you feel justified walking up to a smoker and telling them they should stop? Or telling someone they shouldn't enjoy a beer?...
There's being a good samaritan, and there's being an intrusive jerk. It's not a fine distinction, really.
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I say polar bears exist and suddenly I'm a polar bear. lol
I said nice concerned strangers exist, not that I was one of them.
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You're justifying the behavior and calling it okay. It's more like, ff someone kills and cannibalizes babies and you justify it and say it's not wrong, you're not a cannibalistic baby killer, but you are a person who justifies and okays cannibalizing and killing babies. Not so much the polar bear thing.
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Whether a stranger has true concern or not is irrelevant. What IS relevant is whether or not a stranger has any bearing on what a person does.
The fact is, eating disorders are serious, deep, psychological issues that cannot be fixed by a comment from a random stranger. Family and friends are in a better position both to tell if something is truly wrong (because we seem to be forgetting that size alone is not even a fraction of what is required to diagnose someone with an eating disorder) AND to help right any issues.
By making comments about someone's weight being abnormal, it is FAR more likely they will damage a healthy thin person's self esteem than it is that they'll save someone with a real problem.
Being concerned is sweet, and I've learned to brush off such comments as misguided, but when I was younger and less secure, such comments were truly painful. Why risk hurting someone over such trivialities?
-Kaitlin (the girl in the photo)
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The fact is, eating disorders are serious, deep, psychological issues that cannot be fixed by a comment from a random stranger.
There's mounting evidence that a lot of clinical eating disorders are a form of obsessive-compulsive disorder. Current antipsychotic drugs pretty much wipe out anorexia immediately. BUT - what's weird - is that parents don't want to stigmatize their kids by giving them anti"psychotics" so they try ineffective things like browbeating photographers or behavior modification.
(and, OCD appears to have a significant genetic component. Parents seem to have trouble coping with that fact - they want something else to blame.)
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Heh, well if you're speaking about having any true bearing on what the person winds up doing - of course that's a different matter altogether. A person cant really force another person do to anything, only make a comment or two - which shouldn't come off mean.
Probably best to state now that I didn't think this image was "omg skinny! eat moar!" Just saying that well meaning people shouldn't instantly have their heads ripped off for caring enough to mention something. (and I swear I think people are constantly keeping asshole replies in mind when I say "CARING mention".. >.< It's very easy to tell the difference between the two instances.)
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Right...and I of course understand the difference, but the fact is, in making any comment, you are acknowledging basically that this person looks "wrong". You are telling them (whether good intentioned or not) that they are not normal. I just don't think that's right. I think everyone should try to treat their fellow humans with kindness and dignity, and there is nothing kind or dignified about pointing out perceived flaws in others IMHO, whatever the intention may be.
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If you saw something you personally knew to be really wrong (and I don't mean based on personal taste.. I mean actually wrong) you wouldn't say anything at all out of concern? Ever? Private or otherwise? Simply because you didn't know them?
I personally couldn't accept that. People have been dying in hospital waiting rooms because other people have completely ignored them when they collapsed. =/
You can carry on as you carry on, but I still find it completely unreasonable for people to expect the honest well meaning types to remain silent if they see something alarming like that. Whatever I guess, right?
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And to answer your question, when I see something wrong, I do indeed do something about it.
Hundreds of various scars on a 3 year old combined with a violent fear of belts: wrong
A person outside the standard deviation: not wrong (in my book)
Unless I know there to be medical issues compounding it, it is none of my damn business, not because I am an uncaring human being, but because I am a CARING human being, and I am not about to potentially hurt someone's feelings over my own ignorance.
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Oh but it is purely personal taste. You're proving my point here. If I saw something "wrong"? So it's WRONG to be thin? Look, the only thing it is WRONG to be is unhealthy, and being my size does NOT mean you are unhealthy. I am perfectly healthy, and my doctor can attest to that.
You apparently will never get this because you lack the ability to put yourself in the shoes of others. Keep saying whatever you feel it necessary to say, but do so knowing that you know nothing about the health of ANY person based solely on looks, and you will almost certainly do nothing but make naturally thin people feel ostracized and freakish.
"If you saw something you personally knew to be really wrong..." Give me a break. I'm sorry, but that's a terrible thing to say in this context to someone my size.
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It is true. Totally. It's not warm and fuzzy or necessarily all that polite, but it's totally true. I have zero concern for you. None. What happens to you or doesn't happen to you doesn't bother me in the slightest since I don't know you. You don't impact my life and I don't care what happpens or goes on in your life because of that.
I see all sorts of crappy things happen to people in my job. Serious injuries, sometimes fatal. I am not concerned for those people. If they are kids, different story as the maternal instinct kicks in but we are talking about adults. I think, "ah that sucks" and move on down the road. I don't know them so I don't have any big concern for them.
I know, it sounds pretty brutal and harsh, huh? I guess that's what we get since we've turned into a society of pansy-assed, buttinsky, politically correct victims.
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There are a lot of fireman, policeman, nurses, therapists, adoption agents, emergency services personnel who would like to disagree with you.
... and I am sure 9/11 didn't affect people at all.
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Dude, lame. Try staying in context.
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I'm not sure your eluding to emotional baggage disproves a damned thing I've said.
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Are you for real? We're discussing "concern". That's an emotion. I am stating people don't have genuine true sincere concern for a complete random stranger. You say they do. You are asserting the positive here. It's your damn job to prove it. You've made the assertion, prove it.
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A tangible emotion to physically show you as it happens? I don't think this conversation can get much more dense than it has.
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I'd love to hear how you could expect to be furnished such "proof".
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Since I'm not the one making affirmative assertions that's not my problem. Until then, I am apathetic, disinterested, and unconcerned.
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Meaning "I'm full of crap and know it already".
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Nice ad hominem, by the way. In the real grown-up world that means I win. Thanks for playing!
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Oh you mean the same thing yo pulled? Making you a hypocrite? Awesomesauce.
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Actually, I didn't attack you personally or call you names. Oops.
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(you're not very good at this..)
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And yet I don't have to resort to ad hominem attacks.
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So we've verified you enjoy saying "attack" and "ad hominem" and it doesn't appear like you want to get back on the subject. We done then?
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If y'all are gonna have a childish argument could you please do so via PM? This has nothing to do with the photo, or really even the issue the photo's about anymore.
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You lost the moment you engaged in an ad hominem attack. So yes, you're done. Of course you were done along time ago cause this was dense, remember? And yet you're still here. Cracks me up when people do that.
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Nope, meaning I'm still waiting for you to prove what you can't. I'll not hold my breath.
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You're just playing copout games now. You cant even prove 100% that it DOESN'T happen.
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Glad to see that you care so much about your models that you want to see them eat right...
Personally, I like your models. Even the "thin" ones look great... unlike many of the famous, anorexic ones we see every day on TV.
Kudos on the model AND the message.
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Glad to see that you care so much about your models that you want to see them eat right...
Personally, I like your models. Even the "thin" ones look great... unlike many of the famous, anorexic ones we see every day on TV.
Kudos on the model AND the message.
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Sometimes I have to take extreme measures....
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Great Photo.
I like how a lot of these self-proclaimed health specialists recommend cheeseburgers to thin looking people they do not know, based on a photo.
Or how some people get all alarmist about visible ribs... 
Common sense is just dead.
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Common sense is not just dead, it's been cremated and its ashes scattered to the winds.
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There are heavy elements created in syncotrons that are more common than "common" sense. Some of us have to exercise to keep our weight up. If I stop exercising I drop 15lbs on 5000 calories a day.
Maybe I should lay off the caffeine and sleep more?
And a great photo, but isn't she concerned about the trans fats?
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Yeah, ain't it amusing how the people who can't get themselves under 50% body fat can't stand anyone else who can? That old "if everybody is as fat as me, I'll be beautiful" concept? Gotta love it.
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It's not that they have to be fat to hate skinny people. Honestly, it's the fact that models used to be only slightly slimmer than the average woman, and now they are vastly slimmer, and if you don't have an extremely slender frame, you can't get anywhere in modeling.
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it's the fact that models used to be only slightly slimmer than the average woman
The gap has grown because the average woman has gotten a lot heavier. Models now are about the same build that they have been since the 1940s.
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Marilin Monroe was, what would have been by today's standards, a size 10.
Models are not at all the same build they were in the 1940s.
Modeling was changed hugely by Twiggy and other extremely thin women like her.
Please do your research before making sweeping statements like that.
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I suspect I work with/around more models than you.
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But the point of the discussion from the beginning WAS those who insist on whining about "that model is too skinny" stuff. I don't believe that anybody who does that kind of stuff is doing it out of any sort of altruistic wish to see the models at a healthy weight, nor does it really have anything to do with the fact (and I agree with you that most models push the edge of dangerously underweight) that the models promote "unhealthy underweight" as "true beauty" - I firmly believe that the people who get upset and post hate-notes to photographers like MJ are doing so purely because THEY can't keep their own weight down and can't stand that THEY can't be seen as photo-worthy because of it. Of course I recognize that there are a variety of other cracked individuals who will do such things. Generally I suspect that it's based on outwardly-directed self-hatred. I feel sorry for those people for having that self-hatred, but I also feel distaste for them because they have to punish and victimize others because of it.
Hm... I'm sitting back and taking a look at this whole conversation thread that I sort of started, and wondering how much of it might be caused by my own self-hatred being directed at them. LOL! Ain't that a vicious circle?
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I really don't care about other people's body image issues; it's not my business and it shouldn't have to be. It's when they try to make it my problem that I get annoyed and push back.
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Agreed. I try to be healthy in body and mind, and when I fail, I try to not harm others in my failures. It'd be nice to see more people with similar motto's.
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Damn right. Sometimes it feels like being skinny is actually a problem, something "wrong"...
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Well everyone is convinced everyone MUST have an eating disorder. All the people whose eating disorder is "see-food" (IE: see food, then gotta eat it - ALL.) want the rest of us to think that overweight is the norm, so if you aren't, then YOU have something wrong with you. Some people just know how to exorcize self-control. Of course there are those with legitimate dietary problems, and I'm not knocking them, but too often they just serve as an excuse for somebody whose real problem is a total lack of self-control.
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I agree. One thing that I always found kind of funny too, is the fact that if someone is skinny, any-everybody will tell the person face-to-face without any problem "oh my god you are so skinny" (with a face expression that shows disgust). But if someone is overweight, nobody will ever tell the person face-to-face, because it is considered as something cruel to say, it hurts the person you tell. I guess the explanation of this difference, is the fact that in our society being skinny is something considered as an illness, something that isn't your fault really, while being overweight isn't an illness at all, it a sin, it's the person entire fault (so by telling the person, you actually show them their mistake/sin, you even accuse them in a way). I'm from France so I might have a different point of view than Americans on that one. Someone was talking about jealousy, I quite agree with that too.
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If you wanted to die really really really fast, you could hang out in WAL-MART telling fat people "back off on the hot dogs, huh?" Or walk into a bar and start telling people to dump out their beer because of their incipient alcoholism...
Some people think it's proper to intrude on a complete stranger's life and tell them they are thin - but for some reason it's only that one topic.
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