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ScarecrowsMainFan — The Daleks vs. The Reapers
Published: 2012-08-29 13:12:59 +0000 UTC; Views: 8349; Favourites: 33; Downloads: 63
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It just isn't science fiction without a race of aliens devoted to wiping out all other life in existence. The reasons they want to do it aren't even that important (and sometimes it's better you don't know); you just need to know that they are the bad guys.Of course, by that very token, there can really be only one group of life eradicators... so one of these guys has got to go!
The Daleks: Born on the planet Skaro, the Daleks are the Doctor's oldest and cruelest enemies. They are nothing but hate given form; the greatest sin in all creation, seeking nothing but to wipe out everything that isn't a Dalek from existence, even if that means they have to take out all of reality to do it! Don't let the odd body armor and plungers fool you; these things have destroyed entire solar systems in their conquests, and have even gone toe to toe with the Time Lords of Gallifrey!
The Reapers: A race of synthetic-organic starships; the Reapers reside in Dark Space, a vast starless space between galaxies. They hibernate there, dormant for fifty thousand years at a time, before they are given the signal to return. These massive constructs exist to harvest the galaxy’s sentient life in a repeating cycle of purges that has continued relentlessly over countless millennia!
So who will it be? The mutants or the synthetics? Harvesting or EXTERMINATION? Will the Reapers be able to purge another race from existence? Or will the Daleks simply EXTERMINATE! EXTERMINATE! EXTERMINATE!? Only you can decide...
WHO! IS! DEADLIEST!
In a completely unrelated matter, Doctor Who Season 7 begins this Saturday. AW YEAH!
(Disclaimer: Just to be clear, these two combatants were created / are owned by people far more creative / wealthier then me. I have made this, not for profit, but in the hopes of encouraging spirited discussion among fans. Please support the combatants official series. Thank you, that is all).
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Comments: 150
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I think the Reapers will win this one. The Reapers may have the edge over them in terms of laser-point technology and synthetics, but the Daleks compensate for this with extremely powerful armor and strength in numbers. An individual Dalek is powerful in his own right, given that the little stick on his left can melt down the hardest of metals, their plungers can crush skulls, and their armor allows them to shrug off most types of small arms fire, but they lack maneuvering and are easy to pick off at their slowest. Daleks are merely tankettes, but can tear down groups of Reapers like easy pickings, but since the Reapers have much more better technology, their only hope to stop the Daleks are their gigantic walkers, since Daleks can handle Reaper infantry very easily. And even if they had Brutes and possessed Asari that can barely take down a line of Daleks, they'll still be destroyed nonetheless, because neither can withstand so much laser fire that the Daleks constantly throw out at them. They may have flyers that act as multi-purpose transport, but the Daleks can beat them in gravitation. Since the Daleks aren't entirely flexible given that they have no other models than the standard pepper shaker type, the Reapers can overtax them with different units nonetheless.
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You are saying the Reapers, who cannot even blow up a planet, can take down a race that can destroy the entire infinite multiverse?
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Well, they are by any means, uncountable, as it never mattered to them how many of their own minions are gonna die. Even so, defeated in minor and major fronts has been proven to be little setbacks, much like the Daleks.
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One of the reaper's big advantages in the past is that all their enemy tech was based off of reaper tech. The Reapers did this by design to give them a tactical edge. The Daleks are from a different universe and therefor their tech evolved independently from that of the reapers. As for indoctrination I do not think it would work. Especially if we are talking the original Daleks that killed their creator because he was not a pure Dalek. (Although he was actually only damaged they were under the impression they had killed him) Not to mention the Dalek numbers and firepower. Part of the Reaper power is the use of indoctrinated forces but the Daleks use energy beams that kill with little effort making husks entirely ineffective along with many other indoctrinated species. I really think the Daleks have this in the bag. And that is before you add in their ability to travel time though they have shown they try to avoid creating paradoxes when possible and seem to respect certain rules of time simply to ensure their existence is not put in jeopardy.
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1. Daleks have the ability to travel back in time.
2.reapers don't.
3.daleks travel back in time to the reapers exact moment of creation
4.EXTERMINATE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
5.daleks win
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Indoctrination wouldn't work the Time Lords have some degree of psychic capabilities, so I'm sure they tried to use some sort of psychic weapon against the Daleks and it didn't work, at least not well enough to stop the Daleks.
The Daleks would EXTERMINATE! the Reapers, they might put up more of a fight than most of the Daleks' victims but they would eventually lose.
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Daleks almost destroyed the multiverse.
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That doesn't really work when you're fighting a race with time travel. =/
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The Dalek Empire with ease.
The big reason is that the reapers are for intent and purposes are naked, Kinetic barriers only block kinetic strikes (particle beam weapons are hybrid between dew and kinetic if you think about it), the Daleks use VERY high yield DEWs, that would go straight through the barrier.
The main gun of a Sovereign class reaper srikes with a force equal to 450 kilotons, the Daleks ships are in the Zetatons of firepower.
A daleks ships shields wouls shrug off a bombardment from the entire reaper fleet as a slight blip.
The Reapers are a low end threat in the sci-fi scales, daleks are high end, being a threat to the entire whoverse multiverse...
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This is tough but it might be the daleks. If daleks started getting indoctrinated they might realize and leave a warning for other daleks not to use Reaper technology and then exterminate themselves. If that happened the daleks could find out about the reapers and use their superior firepower to destroy them.
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Okay, I take that back. The Daleks would CRUSH the Reapers! Daleks are a multiversal threat and almost beat the Time Lords, whereas Reapers aren't even fully universal.
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Individually reapers outclass Daleks significantly, but the Daleks have the technological edge. The thought that really chills me is the thought of a reaper Dalek team-up.
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THE DALEKS WOULD NEVER ALLY THEMSELVES WITH AN INFIRIOR SPECIES UNLESS ABSOLUTELY NECCESAREY. THESE REAPERS WILL BE EXTERMINATED.
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Also, the reality bomb is an invention of Davros and if he even tries to study reaper technology, is unaware of the reapers, he would soon serve them.
The deciding factors in a Reaper vs. Dalek war is one races awareness of the other and the use of Indoctrination.
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Remember the Daleks won't serve Davros if they think he is ruining things, the Daleks have betrayed their leader before.
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My point was the reality bomb cannot exist without davros.
Another thing about the reality bomb: it attacks the electro-magnetic bonds of atoms in that universe. In the universe the reapers are from atoms are held together by dark energy, not electro-magnetism. Thus the bomb would not even work against the reapers.
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You know they could just do what they did in canon right? Have Davros build the Reality Bomb for them, and then back-stab him. And that's being extremely generous and assuming the Reapers could survive long enough to indoctrinate Davros (hint: they wouldn't).
Also, the Reality Bomb was stated to destroy stars, so it should fuck up Reapers just fine. The Daleks also have the Apocalypse Element, which destroyed a galaxy four times larger than the Milky Way. They operate on a far larger scale than anything in Mass Effect.
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This line of conversation was meant to cover a situation in which the reapers win. It is sometimes said that the reapers greatest weapon was indoctrination. I beg to differ, it is secrecy, keeping oneself an unknown until it was too late. In the ideal circumstance the reaper armada would quietly observe the daleks, keeping themselves from being discovered, they are known for their patience. Keep in mind their purpose is to harvest organic and synthetic life, not destroy it. I doubt the daleks would be considered an exception to this but they would be handled with careful study via a proxy like the collectors or other indoctrinated agents.
The daleks may have time travel but they lack the perception the reapers have accumulated from their millions of years of existence. The daleks cannot attack a foe they do not even know about. How do you kill an enemy you do not know you have?
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The Reapers' usual strategy of "Sit outside the galaxy and wait for our foe to become vulnerable" wouldn't really work since the Daleks would be going about destroying the entire universe (which we know they're capable of). They could easily win without ever even knowing they were fighting something.
It also helps that a single Dalek saucer would shit all over the entire Reaper armada, considering that they're armed with missiles that can outright blow a planet apart, Death Star style.
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I was talking about Davros serving the Reapers, The Daleks wouldn't hesitate to Exterminate him.
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i know but they would not get the benefits of his mind either.
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I know, without Davros there would be no Special Weapons Dalek or Reality bomb, but there is still the Cult of Skaro to look out for.
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As I recall their task is to account for the Daleks' lack of imagination. Potentially that could backfire if they become convinced that the Daleks could survive best via becoming a reaper. After all Dalek Sek believed that the survival of the Daleks lay in breaking their religious devotion to genetic purity.
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Sec is the most likely to succumb but once again he was exterminated by the Daleks (Thay was it?) I think it would be a close battle however in ship vs ship battles the Daleks have the upper hand, not sure on ground units though.
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Actually, in terms of space combat the reapers have a significant advantage. Their Magnetohydrodynamic cannons (one on each limb) are the most efficent and dangerous ship-to-ship weapon in just about every sci-fi genre. I am looking at it rate of fire (which is constant), damage averages about 291 Kilotones of kinetic force concentrated into a narrow beam, long firing range. Then there is the reapers armor which is tough to penetrate. Then there is their maneuverability and speed. Reapers do not have visible or detectable engines. Their eezo cores allow them to move extremely fast and in any direction.
In the entry "the miracle of Palaven", the reapers demonstrated their ability to adapt and additional capabilities with short range FTL jumps.
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Is their Armour superior to Dalekanium? Also I was under the impression that in terms of threat level the Reapers were some of the weakest antagonists in Science Fiction.
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If you carefully analyze their capabilities, intelligence, and strategies, you will find just the opposite true. As for their armor, it is unique like their design, to each reaper. They are bio-mechanical machines and that leaves me to believe ( That means I can only theorize because Bioware is a little vague when it comes to what reapers are truly capable of, I make educated guesses based upon clues left by the game) that the reapers armor is incredibly thick with regenerative properties.
Of course I am not belittling the vast capabilities of a fully functional dalek empire but I just want to point out the reapers are nothing to sneeze at either.
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Really? cause they always seem so weak, especially when compared to other villians like the Covenant in Halo, Though they do best the Tripods.
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They look weak because people do not always analyze the reapers capabilities which are never fully realized. People see the reapers as ships and only ships. They forget the power and subtle influence of Indoctrination. They forget that all-out assaults are not the reapers primary strategy. They wait in the shadows of the cosmos, watching and waiting for the opportune time to strike. The reapers know they are not invulnerable and thus will utilize other assets to do the work for them.
Have you ever see the film "Independence Day?"
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No I have not seen Independance Day.
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Pity, It would have made a apt comparison for how reapers are adequately suited for the task for which they were made.
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In a stand-up fight the reapers would lose hands down.
However, reapers are not stupid. They would stick to the shadows and bide their time. They would leave their artifacts behind for the daleks to study. Indoctrination would claim them and they would serve the reapers. The reapers gain their technology and the Dalek advantages are lost, the harvest will continue.
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The Daleks would realize they were being mind controlled and the ones starting to be influenced would warn the others and then either self-destruct or be quarantined. Then the Daleks would figure out about the Reapers and destroy them.
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But that is just it, due to the Dalek Hive net they will all be hit at once and thus never realize they are being indoctrinated.
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I'm not sure the Dalek Hive works like that. Also, even if it did, the Daleks might realize in time to purge the hive of the indoctrination or something. There is also no evidence to suggest that any Dalek faction before the New Dalek Paradigm had a Hive.
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I believe that indoctrination is so subtle I doubt the Daleks would ever quite realize that they have been compromised until they have a civil war on their hands.
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How do you know it's that subtle (I don't know much about it)?
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If the dalek hive-web is very sensitive then all would be infected. If it is not very sensitive than they would not subtle influence of indoctrination. The reapers can control how much an individual is indoctrinated and how quickly. Good for creating sleep agents.
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Yeah, I suppose the Reaper indoctrination could cause a problem for the Daleks. I'm still not convinced the Reapers could win. If the Daleks managed to destroy the indoctrinated Daleks, even if there were only a few Daleks left, they could rebuild their empire and then the Reapers would be in trouble. It is also possible that the Daleks wouldn't even be interested in studying "inferior" technology. That may even be likely given Daleks' attitude toward anything not Dalek.
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Exactly how powerful is Reaper indoctrination? In the Doctor Who expanded universe, the Master - a genius even by Time Lord standards - attempted to subvert the Daleks and failed, even though he had physical access to their hardware while they were powered down, giving him the opportunity to analyse their programming and construction at leisure. Keep in mind that these were very early Daleks they didn't even begin to approach the Daleks that fought the Time Lords.
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Keep in mind a dalek is part organic. Reaper Indoctrination requires close proximity to their technology and can influence them in a matter of days. Once an individual is indoctrinated the reapers hold over them is absolute and because it corrodes the mind over time, it is also irreversible.
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"A matter of days"? That's more than enough time for the Daleks to figure out what is going on, destroy the artefacts, trace the signal back to the Leviathans on Reality Bomb the hell out of them.
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No, Leviathan artifacts take weeks, Reaper Indoctrination a matter of days. Also both reaper and Leviathan communications are untraceable. It is also doubtful that unless Davros himself is examining the artifacts of either the Leviathans or the reapers, they will not realize that Indoctrination has spread until it was too late. Though the daleks have the advantage with sheer firepower, the reapers still maintain a technological advantage because their technology is a perfect fusion of organism and machine and is thus a little beyond dalek science.
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"A little beyond Dalek science"? Are we even thinking of the same Daleks? Because the Daleks I'm thinking of can destroy galaxies, destroy universes, destroy multiverses, casually travel through different dimensions, build ships that can exist in places where physics themselves don't exist, travel through time, etc.
What makes you think that Reapers are more advanced?
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Reaper are more advanced in the biomechanical department, Daleks still have the advantage with their other technology. I am pointing at a very specific technology and science of the reapers that has never been the daleks strong point, genetics and biomechanics.
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But the Daleks would still be able to avoid indoctrination, because the other daleks would realize through Pathnet that a Dalek was being modified or subvert it and shut it down or order it to self destruct. And let's not forget that the Daleks have the nanocloud, their own version of indoctrination. (Asylum of the Daleks)
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