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history-nerd — Complete Art Book Tank Profile Scans: the P40
#anzio #book #carro #complete #p40 #profile #scans #tank #armato #art
Published: 2014-12-08 16:09:09 +0000 UTC; Views: 1377; Favourites: 5; Downloads: 12
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Description
A while ago on a magazine appeared some of these, which soon came to encompass all the tanks shown in the anime... minus the ones used by Anzio (quite logically, given that the OVA was still being prepared and such), therefore not being very much "complete".Recently, in a booklet those beauties appeared... the tank profiles for the three Anzio tanks. Here you go, then!
This is the first, depicting Anzio's heaviest hitter: the Carro Armato P40!
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Comments: 16
Bel carro,anche se di molto inferiore agli altri carri coevi.
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Bé, non direi di molto inferiore... Come potenza di fuoco, protezione e mobilità non era particolarmente inferiore rispetto alle prime versioni dell'M4 Sherman; un problema era la torretta a due uomini anziché a tre, che costringeva il capocarro a fare anche da cannoniere, che era un'arcaismo e ostacolava il coordinamento.
Tuttavia, tutto sommato un carro in condizione di combattere, se non in condizioni di parità, almeno con discrete prospettive di successo contro i loro potenziali avversari più diffusi, appunto gli Sherman.
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Sono certo che fosse in grado di avere la meglio sugli sherman,ma nello stesso periodo esistevano anche i Tiger e i T-34 (tanto per fare 2 nomi ma di carri pesanti ce ne sono un sacco) che avevano una corazzatura e un armamento superiore.
Inoltre la corazza inbullonata rappresentava un pericolo,in caso di impatto violento anche se la corazza avesse resistito i bulloni potevano schizzare verso l'interno ferendo l'equipaggio.
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Il Tiger era di sicuro superiore (anche perché era un "vero" carro pesante, mentre il P40 lo era solo in base alla differente classificazione in uso in Italia), ma il T-34 aveva in ogni sua versione una corazzatura equivalente a quella del P40; quest'ultimo poi aveva armamento equivalente a quello del T-34/76, anche se inferiore a quello del T-34/85.
Hmmm... su quello recentemente c'è qualcuno che dice che in realtà non era un fenomeno così importante, anche se è una discussione ancora aperta...
In ogni caso, ovviamente intendevo carri medi coevi, che dopotutto erano quelli più diffusi. E' ovvio che i carri pesanti, come ad esempio il Churchill britannico, erano fuori portata.
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C'è da dire che il p40 è stato sviluppato dopo lo studio di un T-34 catturato che ci passarono i tedeschi,quindi è logico che abbia delle somiglianze.
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The Italians finally get it right in a medium tank...just in time for Italy to bow out of the Axis. I bet Anchovy goes ballistic if you remind her that more P40 types were used by the Wehrmacht than the Italian army. Incidentally, most of the German-crewed P40 tanks were used at the battle of Anzio.
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To be honest, I've yet to see a true reliable source which explains in details the use of the P40 at Anzio... though I have no doubt that some were indeed used. In the Yukari's Tank Corner dedicated to Anzio it is mentioned that in the last days of the war (around April 1945) German troops with some P40s assigned met some British Shermans, and though it ended in defeat for them the P40 managed to take out at least one of them.
Yes, the P40 would have given the Italian tankers a tank with which they could fight back against their opponent; but that was not supposed to be.
On the fact that it wasn't used by the Italians, what does Darjeeling think about the Sherman Firefly used by Naomi of Saunders?
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The info for Wehrmacht P40s at Anzio all comes from Axis logistic records and German records for equipment seizures during Operation Alaric. I have accepted the information as genuine, because the Germans frequently used foreign-made equipment to make ends meet, and the P40 was a tank with more clout to it than any Mark III, with the same level of armor. And the factories that made it were in the north, so parts wouldn't be an issue, right? The hard-pressed GIs at the Anzio beachhead could have cared less if the panzers pressing towards the beach were P40 or Mark IV types. (The few first-hand accounts I have read from the GI perspective at Anzio are short on technical detail for some obvious reasons of survival over detailed observation. )
Darjeeling couldn't object over Saunders using a Firefly, since the only British thing about it was the gun. (Darjeeling's team uses all-British designs as a point of pride.) Swap the 17-pounder with an American 76mm gun and you have "Fury", so no foul there. 
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Interesting... have those records been published somewhere? I'm asking because I'd like to see them. It might be the source I was talking about.
Of course; any tank at that point was better than nothing. And I think however that the P40 had somewhat better armor than a Panzer III; at most the Mk. III had 70 mm of vertical armor, the P40 had 50 mm of sloped armor on the hull and 60 on the gun mantlet.
Well, perhaps... but I think she has other things to worry about.
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An old book on WW II armor that I owned & later gave to a friend had the first information on the topic, although there was no photograph of the tank itself. WIkipedia has the basic data, but the article doesn't have a lot of citations. The best English-language source that comes to mind would be Italian Medium Tanks from Osprey Publication's "New Vanguard" line. The New Vanguard series is a boon for the GuP fan who wants to be able to do mad data citations for major nerd credit.
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I see; I know that Wikipedia doesn't have that much info, and perhaps I think I could give it a hand (as an Italian, I do have a few Italian sources! ).
I have the book you mentioned; I like it, because it was written by two of the foremost experts on Italian armor of WWII, which are of course Italian!
(Not that it's mandatory, but I can hardly see someone of the likes of Steven Zaloga deciding all of a sudden to explore this niche!)
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Obviously this is a field that demands some clarification. You must resolve the situation for our benefits!
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Well, I did something (very little) on a few pages... a lot more to go...
I'm also trying to put some info of the sorts in the pages detailing the Western Desert Campaign, so that we might read something else than "the Italiam tanks were all obsolete and hopelessly outmatched"... something that tells us why they were outclassed, and why some were not as outclassed as we believed...
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I still give the credit for any effectiveness of the Italian tanks on their crews. When I was young and stat-focused, I too poured scorn on all things pertaining to Mussolini's armed forces. It wasn't until much later that I could appreciate the courage it took to get into a fighting machine one knows is inferior to the enemy's opposite, and go forward, because others are depending on one's best effort, however futile it might seem.
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Well, I appreciate the sentiment, but we have to be cautious; the first tank units to see service in North Africa, between late 1940 and early 1941 (those with M11/39s and the first M13/40s) were made up of soldiers with almost no training at all. Only some 25 days of training, a few hours of driving for the drivers and six rounds fired by each gunner; in those condition, even having much better vehicles wouldn't have warranted much better results, in my opinion.
Besides, even though it had many flaws, the M13/40 and the M14/41 weren't completely devoid of qualities, and the main one was the armament; sure, it went obsolete pretty quickly, but till 1941 it was still enough to fight enemy cruiser tanks (up to the 2-Pounder version of the Crusader). And versus the 2-Pounder it had the advantage of being able to fire efficient HE rounds, which in my opinion gave the M tanks better anti-infantry capacity than all the British tanks armed with the 2-Pounder.
But of course, the fact remains that even the best of these vehicles (including the Semovente) had to be used by people who knew how to use them best. And I believe that they had to learn pretty quickly.
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