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Steveoc86 In reply to Saxophlutist [2007-09-30 10:17:00 +0000 UTC]

Probably, though I'm not shure, the most common skull you see is the triangular, wedged shaped one. [link] the image above is based of a more recent reconstruction by Gregory Paul. Apparently earlier skulls were heavily crushed.

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Saxophlutist In reply to Steveoc86 [2007-09-30 16:13:52 +0000 UTC]

Oh neat! They even include the orbit!

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Steveoc86 In reply to Saxophlutist [2007-09-30 17:29:05 +0000 UTC]

The skull I showed you was actually the older one, Pauls as very different.

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CanisLupus9 In reply to Steveoc86 [2010-02-01 18:01:02 +0000 UTC]

The wings are really detailed, and it's face seems really life-like. I notice you've put this drawing up on wikipedia, I've been trying to do that with my dromaeosaurus albertensis sketch I did, but it won't let me.

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Steveoc86 In reply to CanisLupus9 [2010-02-01 19:09:47 +0000 UTC]

Thank you. If you want to donate an image to wikipedia I advise you post it on the image reivew page, where it will be reviewed for accuracy.
[link]

Your Dromaeosaurus sketch is well drawn but there are a few problems with the accuracy.

The hands are 'pronated'; they are facing the legs.
It's genrally thought that theropods couldn't do this; the hands should be faceing each other. Like when you hold a ball between your hands or when you're clapping.

Known dromeosaurs and other maniraptorian fossils with wings preserved show longer wing feathers which carry on down and along the hand and second finger, just like in birds. It's possible that some lost or reduced the wings, but there is currently no evidence of this. It makes more sence to go with the most likley option with the most evidence. As an artist you can do what you wan't, but remember the Wiki is an encyclopedia, it's best that the images follow as much of the evidence as possible.

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CanisLupus9 In reply to Steveoc86 [2010-02-04 23:38:12 +0000 UTC]

Thanks for taking the time to write this up, the information about the dromaeosaurus has really helped. I am trying to get the position of the hands right, and also trying to extend the feathers of the arms down to the middle finger, but I'm having trouble getting the shape of he feathers right. I'm also findin it difficult shading the feathers on it's right arm. Just need more practice I guess. Thanks for the help anyway mate, much appreciated

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Steveoc86 In reply to CanisLupus9 [2010-02-05 11:04:32 +0000 UTC]

No problem. If you need reference for the wings just look at a tone of bird photos.

Also, remeber that dromaeosaurs and probably aniamls like archaeopteryx didn't have wing feathers on the upper arm. Only on the lower arm, hand and finger.

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CanisLupus9 In reply to Steveoc86 [2010-02-05 22:54:17 +0000 UTC]

Thanks again for the extra information. I didn't know that the wing feathers were only on the lower arms, that's what I like about these animals; there's always something new to be learnt about them.
I think I might just restart the dromaeosaurus sketch again so I can make it larger, more detailed, and add all those extra accuracies. The reason I wanted to draw it in the first place was so I could try and picture what it would have looked like when it was alive, so your help has been invaluable. Thanks man.

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Steveoc86 In reply to CanisLupus9 [2010-02-06 11:30:35 +0000 UTC]

Check out this image by MattMart

[link]

I like how he has done the wings. If I ever upate this image I might make the wings look a bit more like his.

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CanisLupus9 In reply to Steveoc86 [2010-02-06 13:43:59 +0000 UTC]

Yeah, that is a pretty accurate rendition of the wings. I wonder though, why dromaeosaurids still retained feathers like this on their arms, surely it would have hindered their ability to hunt. Who knows? Display purposes perhaps? But I don't think it could be that simple, I suppose we'll never know for sure, we can only speculate.
In case you were wondering, I drew the head of the dromaeosaurus bold and featherless, because I thought that maybe feathers would have become matted over time when it's digging its snout into a carcass to feed (natural selection may have reduced the facial feathers, much like present day vultures), what do you think? [link]

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Steveoc86 In reply to CanisLupus9 [2010-02-07 10:41:28 +0000 UTC]

Very well drawn, I like the way you have rendered the feathering.

Personally I'n not a fan of bald heads these days. It's certainly possible that some had semi bald/bald heads but the evidence for dromaeosaurs doesn't seem to support it at the moment. As far as I know there is no evidence for scaly heads and hands in feathered dinosaurs. Sorry for the breif answer but I'm a little rushed at the moment, click on the link to the wiki Image Review I posted above. I think lot of these ideas have been discussed there.

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Steveoc86 In reply to Brad-ysaurus [2007-07-23 22:41:50 +0000 UTC]

Thanks, good point. When i origanally drew it i gave it those Jurassic Park Style lips that cover the teeth. I assume that idea is wrong?

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